EconoMonitor

Nouriel Roubini's Global EconoMonitor

RGE Monitor – 2009 Global Economic Outlook (Q1 update)

Today we present some of the main conclusions of the recently released update to the RGE 2009 Global Economic Outlook.

The global economy is in the middle of a synchronized contraction that will push global growth into negative territory in 2009 for the first time in decades. This will be the worst financial crisis since the Great Depression and the worst global economic downturn in decades.  Global trade volumes face their sharpest contractions of the postwar era – trade is expected to contract 12% in 2009 due to the severe and prolonged global demand slump, excess capacity across supply chains and the continued crunch in trade finance.

Many analysts and commentators are pointing out that the second derivative of economic activity is turning positive (i.e. economies are still contracting but a slower rather than accelerated rate) and that green shoots of an economic recovery are blossoming.  RGE Monitor’s analysis of the data suggests that the global economic contraction is still in full swing with a very severe, a deep and protracted U-shaped recession. Last year’s economic consensus forecast of a V-shaped short and shallow recession has vanished.  While the rate of economic contraction is slowing compared to the free fall rates of Q4 of 2008 and Q1 of 2009, we are still a long way away from the economic bottom and from a sustained recovery of growth.  In particular, in Europe and Japan there is little evidence of a positive second derivative of economic activity.

However by the end of Q1 2009, there were some signs that the pace of contraction had slowed in many economies especially in the U.S. and China, where policy responses have been more significant and leading indicators in the manufacturing sector may have bottomed before they did in Europe and Japan. However, major economies including all of the G7 will continue to contract throughout 2009, albeit at a slower pace than at the beginning of the year.

Moreover the global recovery might be sluggish at best in 2010 given the overhang of credit losses of financial institutions, lingering credit crunch, need for retrenchment by overstretched and over-indebted households in current account deficit countries and a slow resumption of demand prompted by extensive government stimulus.

Some key elements of RGE Monitor’s outlook include:

  • Global economic activity is expected to contract by 1.9% in 2009. Advanced economies are expected to contract 4% in 2009. Japan and the eurozone will suffer the sharpest downturns. U.S. GDP will continue to contract, albeit at a slower pace throughout 2009, with negative growth in every quarter.
  • Emerging markets will slow down sharply from the stellar growth rates of the past few years, with the BRIC economies growing at half their 2008 pace.
  • Deteriorated terms of trade, slower capital flows and tighter credit will push Latin America into recession from the 4.1% growth of 2008.   Argentina, Brazil, Chile, Colombia, Mexico, and Venezuela will all shift to negative territory on a year-over-year basis while smaller countries, like Peru, will experience a significant slowdown.
  • Countries in Eastern Europe and the CIS will experience some of the sharpest contractions given the withdrawal of foreign credit and the risk of a severe financial crisis. The reduction in oil revenues and financial stress will contribute to a 5% yoy contraction in Russia and some countries – especially in the Baltics – are at risk of double-digit contractions
  • Export-dependent Asia’s growth will slow significantly to less than 3% in 2009.  China will have a hard landing with GDP growth falling to 5.5% while India will slow sharply to 4.3%. All four Asian Tigers (Singapore, Taiwan, South Korea and Hong Kong) as well as Malaysia and Thailand will experience recessions.
  • The Middle East and Africa will mark much slower growth, half of their 2008 pace, given the reduction in capital inflows, reduced demand from the U.S. and EU and decline in commodity prices and output. Israel and South Africa will suffer slight contractions.
  • The unprecedented fiscal and monetary stimulus may help alleviate the substantial contraction in private demand and reduce the risk of a global L-shaped near-depression. Debt financing may be a challenge for many countries though, especially emerging markets or the most vulnerable Western European economies.
  • Job losses during the current global recession might exceed those in recent recession, contributing to increases in defaults and posing additional risks to banks. The unemployment rate in developed countries will reach double-digits by 2010 (as early as mid-2009 in the U.S.) and push more people in developing countries into poverty. Moreover, despite new funding from multilateral institutions, severe contractions will raise the risk of social and political unrest.
  • Commodities as a class are likely to come under renewed pressure in 2009 despite some support from production cuts.  RGE expects the WTI oil price to average about $40 a barrel in 2009 as demand destruction continues to outweigh crude supply destruction.

The entire RGE 2009 Global Economic Outlook is available to RGE subscribers.

325 Responses to “RGE Monitor – 2009 Global Economic Outlook (Q1 update)”

orange juiceApril 23rd, 2009 at 7:08 am

secundo!why is it that commodities would come under such pressure? wouldn’t the stimulus and other attempts to restore economic growth cause prices to stay even, or is it due to excess inventory/overhang in a stagnant market?it just seems like there is still demand for goods in poorer parts of the world that haven’t seen prices this cheap since 4-5 years ago and they may result to hoarding/est. a base from which prices can remain flat.

devils advocateApril 23rd, 2009 at 7:18 am

Dr. Roubini: “you may be right but you may be wrong”cooked books…crooked markets…your analysis is honest and sharphowever, I disagree with your conclusionsoil and stocks will slowly rise: oil is rising and stocks are no longer falling despite everythingPonzis and Madoffs and media experts are running our banks-and-government

FEDupApril 23rd, 2009 at 7:37 am

Good article at marketwatch.com entitled “Jack Bauer cam’t stop the Goldman Conspiracy” – 10 reasons why Wall Street has absolute power over America’s democracy

GuestApril 23rd, 2009 at 9:07 am

Thom Hartmann on his radio talk show said yesterday that this administration is like the last several administrations: it appears to be in the hands of Wall Street.In a reference to an important issue for Progressives as well as Libertarians, Hartmann said that in Obama’s visit with Latin American leaders, there apparently was not even a mention of renegotiating NAFTA. The Obama campaign, before the election, allowed union leaders and others to believe that solving the NAFTA problem would be a front burner issue with an Obama Administration.Earlier in the program, Hartmann said that the talk about an economic recovery is becoming a sucker’s game and that the Wall Street rally is really a bull within a bear. Hartmann said if Wall Street is able to attract enough investors who have already suffered substantial losses into re-entering the market for possible new gains, then the bankers will be able to successfully get the rest of the investors’ money.If the bankers can convince Americans to keep bailing them out, Hartmann said, then they, the bankers, mean to once again become the dominant force on Wall Street. He emphasized that this in no way means the economy will dominate markets; it just means that Wall Street will run up the stock market rather than the economy running it up. He seemed doubtful it was going to work second time around.

MM CAApril 23rd, 2009 at 9:08 am

as if we didnt already know…. California leading the way as it always does….Four states dominate city foreclosure rankingsThe top 26 areas are in California, Florida, Arizona and Nevadahttp://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/30332520/

MM CAApril 23rd, 2009 at 9:10 am

thinking about buying a home- be careful, be VERY careful…For Housing Crisis, the End Probably Isn’t Nearhttp://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/22/business/economy/22leonhardt.html?_r=2&adxnnl=1&ref=business&adxnnlx=1240495237-4MWrETHi9NVHx7Opy1g5gw

MM CAApril 23rd, 2009 at 9:12 am

Bank Profits Appear Out of Thin Airhttp://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/21/business/21sorkin.html?_r=1&ref=business

MM CAApril 23rd, 2009 at 9:16 am

Want to invest in stocks… Just think about the fortune 500 companies who saw profits decline from 500B to under 100B as a whole in the past year… I suspect the current year will find the Fortune 500 with a combined loss…. Consumption is dead except for the most basic neccessities….By This Measure, a Battered Bottom LineCaterpillar’s Giant Swing to a Loss Reflects Deep Trouble for American Businesshttp://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/04/21/AR2009042103802.html

MM CAApril 23rd, 2009 at 9:18 am

Small and medium size businesses are going out of business at am alarming rate… And new business starts are a pipe dream these days…Record Number Of State Businesses Close In First Quarterhttp://www.courant.com/business/hc-connecticut-business-closing.artapr21,0,5093916.story

AnonymousApril 23rd, 2009 at 9:24 am

I was listening to CNBC while reading this and noticed the stark contrast between CNBC’s bright, optimistic outlook and insistence that everything is bottoming now, preceding a recovery in housing soon and the economy later this year – they said essentially the same things repeatedly in 2007 and 2008. The banks are reported to be doing great now, but no mention anymore of the government’s collusion with them to produce the appearance of profitability. So far, RGE has been correct and CNBC’s always optimistic, bullish guests and regulars have been wrong.

economicminorApril 23rd, 2009 at 9:37 am

There are many who believe that, IF monetary expansion overwhelms debt collapse, commodities will be the first recipient of expansion in demand. And because of the recent problems with funding, many resource projects have been shuttered. This does seem to be a reasonable assumption as increased demand and lower production plus resource scarcity should all result in higher prices.I believe that the belief in a shorter recession than will occur is partly why prices have remained high. Also there is reason to believe that some of the to big to fail institutions have taken the government bail out money and hedged forward with important resources. I also have read that China is using some of its vast monetary reserves in purchasing forward many high demand resources such as copper and oil. These pressures are keeping costs high in many industries and that is keeping them from aggressively lowering prices which IMO is exacerbating job losses.All of this appears to assume that demand will return to previous levels in a reasonably short time. I just can not see this happening for multiple reasons. One is the Boomers will not return to previous levels of consumption. Another is that the rest of the world is not set up socially or physically to accumulate vast quantities of stuff. America is unique in more ways than people gave us credit for. We have big homes and big garages to store lot of stuff where it is relatively secure. There are few places in the world like America.Americans are already over their heads in debt. I just don’t see a lot of room for us to be expansive again for some years. We have to pay down existing debts and use all the stuff we already bought. So I don’t see a great turn around in world wide consumption for a while anyway. Without a turn around, resources demand will continue to dampen. As for China, they are in a dilemma. The dollars they hold are going to be worth less so spending them on resources that might be worth less makes sense. It may not make so much sense for the to big to fail institutions who have been making bad bets for years now.Time will tell.

economicminorApril 23rd, 2009 at 9:51 am

The piece you are overlooking is the incredible debt to income ratio in the US.What is going on with oil is a hope of return to previous economic expansion… YET that is not going to happen for multiple reasons. Debt is primary but then there is demographics and how the social and political structures in the rest of the world are configured.Any attempt at recovery before the levels of debt are reduced will result in a short term slow down in decline leading to an eventual waterfall decline. Especially when those in charge still believe in trickle down economic theory. It has been a disaster. Trickle up works but trickle down only amasses more and more wealth in the hands of the few who have NO idea what to do with it except gamble.

GuestApril 23rd, 2009 at 9:59 am

Is America the new Russia? By Martin Wolf | The Financial TimesApril 14, 2009 — Is the US Russia? The question seems provocative, if not outrageous. Yet the person asking it is Simon Johnson, former chief economist at the International Monetary Fund and a professor at the Sloan School of Management at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology. In an article in the May issue of the Atlantic Monthly, Prof Johnson compares the hold of the “financial oligarchy” over US policy with that of business elites in emerging countries. Do such comparisons make sense? The answer is Yes, but only up to a point.“In its depth and suddenness,” argues Prof Johnson, “the US economic and financial crisis is shockingly reminiscent of moments we have recently seen in emerging markets.” The similarity is evident: large inflows of foreign capital; torrid credit growth; excessive leverage; bubbles in asset prices, particularly property; and, finally, asset-price collapses and financial catastrophe.“But,” adds Prof Johnson, “there’s a deeper and more disturbing similarity: elite business interests – financiers, in the case of the US – played a central role in creating the crisis, making ever-larger gambles, with the implicit backing of the government, until the inevitable collapse.” Moreover, “the great wealth that the financial sector created and concentrated gave bankers enormous political weight.Now, argues Prof Johnson, the weight of the financial sector is preventing resolution of the crisis. Banks “do not want to recognise the full extent of their losses, because that would likely expose them as insolvent … This behaviour is corrosive: unhealthy banks either do not lend (hoarding money to shore up reserves) or they make desperate gambles on high-risk loans and investments that could pay off big, but probably won’t pay off at all. In either case, the economy suffers further, and, as it does, bank assets themselves continue to deteriorate – creating a highly destructive cycle.”Does such an analysis make sense? This is a question I thought about during my recent three-month stay in New York and visits to Washington, DC, now capital of global finance. It is why Prof Johnson’s analysis is so important.Unquestionably, we have witnessed a massive rise in the significance of the financial sector. In 2002, the sector generated an astonishing 41 per cent of US domestic corporate profits (see chart). In 2008, US private indebtedness reached 295 per cent of gross domestic product, a record, up from 112 per cent in 1976, while financial sector debt reached 121 per cent of GDP in 2008. Average pay in the sector rose from close to the average for all industries between 1948 and 1982 to 181 per cent of it in 2007…[ Prof Johnson] argues that the refusal of powerful institutions to admit losses – aided and abetted by a government in thrall to the “money-changers” – may make it impossible to escape from the crisis. Moreover, since the US enjoys the privilege of being able to borrow in its own currency it is far easier for it than for mere emerging economies to paper over cracks, turning crisis into long-term economic malaise. So we have witnessed a series of improvisations or “deals” whose underlying aim is to rescue as much of the financial system as possible in as generous a way as policymakers think they can get away with.I agree with the critique of the policies adopted so far. In the debate on the Financial Times’s economists’ forum on Treasury secretary Tim Geithner’s “public/private investment partnership”, the critics are right: if it works, it is because it is a non-transparent way of transferring taxpayer wealth to banks. But it is unlikely to fill the capital hole that the markets are, at present, ignoring, as Michael Pomerleano argues. Nor am I persuaded that the “stress tests” of bank capital under way will lead to action that fills the capital hole.Yet do these weaknesses make the US into Russia? No. In many emerging economies corruption is egregious and overt. In the US, influence comes as much from a system of beliefs as from lobbying (although the latter was not absent). What was good for Wall Street was deemed good for the world. The result was a bipartisan programme of ill-designed deregulation for the US and, given its influence, the world.Moreover, the belief that Wall Street needs to be preserved largely as it is now is mainly a consequence of fear. The view that large and complex financial institutions are too big to fail may be wrong. But it is easy to understand why intelligent policymakers shrink from testing it. At the same time, politicians fear a public backlash against large infusions of public capital. So, like Japan, the US is caught between the elite’s fear of bankruptcy and the public’s loathing of bail-outs. This is a more complex phenomenon than the “quiet coup” Prof Johnson describes.Yet decisive restructuring is indeed necessary. This is not because returning the economy to the debt-fuelled growth of recent years is either feasible or desirable. But two things must be achieved: first, the core financial institutions must become credibly solvent; and, second, no profit-seeking private institution can remain too big to fail. That is not capitalism, but socialism. That is one of the points on which the right and the left agree. They are right. Bankruptcy – and so losses for unsecured creditors – must be a part of any durable solution. Without that change, the resolution of this crisis can only be the harbinger of the next.http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/09f8c996-2930-11de-bc5e-00144feabdc0.html

GuestApril 23rd, 2009 at 10:03 am

@OJ”haven’t seen prices this cheap since 4-5 years ago”What country do you live in? This deflation everyone speaks of just doesn’t add up. Tell me: What prices are falling other than electronics and housing? It might be happening but I don’t see it, particularly with essentials. I think the government continues to play with the statistics.

GuestApril 23rd, 2009 at 10:58 am

I wonder when the prices will start to fall in the wealthy, coastal areas of CA. In places like Newport Beach, there has been about 400% appreciation in the last 10-15 years. So far, these areas have hardly seen any decline at all relative to other areas, except for condos. I get the feeling some of these areas are just starting to see some cracks.

wawawaApril 23rd, 2009 at 11:05 am

Simon observation does not surprise me. SeeScientist has been wrong saying that our universe revolves around sun. It always had/has/will been revolving around MONEY.

PeteCAApril 23rd, 2009 at 11:15 am

I don’t want to distract too much from the economic discussion here. A couple of quick replies to my earlier comments, and feedback from readers.The point of discussing Pakistan, Iran, and nuclear weapons is not to disseminate propaganda or to vent political diatribes. The point is that the world is changing. American power is ebbing and our ability to “control” global events is diminishing.We need to change our world view, or we will be hostage to old policies that don’t work.The Taliban have made advances in both Swat and Buner (Pakistan). Yes, these are mountainous regions well away from central life in Pakistan. But 5 years ago it would have been considered “unthinkable” that the Taliban occupied any of these districts. No, the Taliban may not be able to strike Islamabad from where they are. But that’s not the real change. The issue is that Pakistan may crumble from within. If a majority of the population decides to favor the more hardline Islamic parties – then we can’t change that. It is not necessary for the Taliban to achieve “airlift capability”. Pakistan is shaky on both economic and political tems. The country is becoming open to a more sweeping change in ideology. That’s something we may be unable to prevent.A far as the Iranians go – if they wanted peaceful nuclear reactors they could have proceeded on a dozen different paths (all fully acceptable to the world community). The path they are currently on puts them in a direct position to achieve nuclear weapons capability in the short term. No-one knows when exactly they might do that – or if they will. It could be sooner or later. But they are in a position to make this fundamental change in power very soon.My comments are not intended to “scare” people. I am not advocating right-wing Republican ideologies or political claptrap. The problem we face in the USA is not dependent on party lines. We face the bigger issue of dealing with a world that is changing rapidly, and our ability to influence that world will be reduced. Things that were once considered “unthinkable” may have to be revised. I can’t tell which way the Obama administration will move on these issues. But they will face them. Pehaps we will try to change things. Or maybe America will be forced to accept changes in the world that we don’t like – and adjust our policies accordingly. The world is not our apple any more.PeteCA

GuestApril 23rd, 2009 at 11:59 am

Professor Johnson wins his argument hands down. Martin Wolf argues as an apologist for Wall Street.The overt and egregious corruption of which Wolf speaks is overt and egregious regardless of what country engages in it. To argue that in the US, “influence comes as much from a system of beliefs as from lobbying” and that “ what was good for Wall Street was deemed good for the world,” is untrue. The only people taken in by this argument, IMO, are in the U.S. Congress. As for America’s “system of beliefs,” it is true that as the ACLU systematically rips The Ten Commandments off the walls of America’s courthouses, it is ripping off her culture, but that is being achieved through duplicitous judges, not by the will of the people.It is true that years ago there was a feeling that what was good for Wall Street was good for America on the general belief that Wall Street represented American business, that its growth represented a growth in America that provided for jobs, security, prosperity. But it has been years since the people viewed Wall Street as a barometer for American business. It was a mistaken belief then, but now, it’s obvious to all thinking people that it is not true. It’s rather a crime for Wolf to say differently, but he’s shown before that he is not dependable.As for Wolf’s premise that “the belief that Wall Street needs to be preserved largely as it is now is mainly a consequence of fear,” I contend that the fear comes from politicians of the bankers who hold their congressional jobs in the balance. Wolf’s argument here is generalized mush–wasted words.As for Wolf’s assertion that “the core financial institutions must become credibly solvent,” must they? To create a viable financial system keeping on the current core of financials that Wolf appears to be talking about, providing that they are solvent, is living in a fantasy world. To think that with a little restructuring, if they do become solvent, that this current core of financials is going to become honest is more than most people can believe. Americans want solvent companies that play by the same rules that the rest of us play by, namely, that you can’t call Barney Frank 24/7 and tell him what to do. If these banks can’t operate honestly like the rest of us, then it is immaterial whether they are solvent or not. They need to be “unhere.”I agree with Wolf’s conclusion, however, that this “is not capitalism, but socialism…that “Bankruptcy – and so losses for unsecured creditors – must be a part of any durable solution. Without that change, the resolution of this crisis can only be the harbinger of the next.”

GuestApril 23rd, 2009 at 12:05 pm

Clothes have fallen. Furniture, appliances, real estate. Dinners out have fallen. Salon services. Hotel stays. Autos. Food bought at a grocery store seems not to have taken too much of a hit, yet.

MM CAApril 23rd, 2009 at 12:14 pm

I agree totally… But the US is our core apple… It Just seems Obama and the US is fighting fires everywhere these days both domestically and abroad. I always hold my hat on we are still strongest military in the world, with a not too well known missile defense system that protects us as well as the most capable Nuclear arsenal in the world… So if all these whacky fundamentalist people and countries trully want to harm us or attack us, we have the means to respond and protect our own country.We should nuke our banking industry instead and start from scratch…

MM CAApril 23rd, 2009 at 12:20 pm

now the fun is starting… the Wealthy starting to eat thier own… We will see a lot more of this the next few months…. The power of the internet cannto be underestimated… EVERYONE is a reporter now….. F..k Mainstream news….Hank Paulson admitted to Andrew Cuomo that he threatened to oust Ken Lewis and the Bank of America board if Bank of America invoked a Material Adverse Change (MAC) clause to block the deal, Cuomo says. Paulson also added, however, that he made this threat at the request of Ben Bernanke.This contradicts Bernanke, who earlier denied (through a Fed spokesman) that he did not threaten Ken Lewis.Here’s an excerpt of Andrew Cuomo’s letter to Congress:In an interview with this Office, Secretary Paulson largely corroborated Lewis’s account.On the issue of terminating management and the Board, Secretary Paulson indicated that he toldLewis that if Bank of America were to back out of the Merrill Lynch deal, the government eithercould or would remove the Board and management. Secretary Paulson told Lewis a series ofconcerns, including that Bank of America’s invocation of the MAC would create systemic riskand that Bank of America did not have a legal basis to invoke the MAC (though SecretaryPaulson’s basis for the opinion was e,ntirely based on what he was told by Federal Reserveofficials).Secretary Paulson’s threat swayed Lewis. According to Secretary Paulson, after he statedthat the management and the Board could be removed, Lewis replied, “that makes it simple.Let’s deescalate.” Lewis admits that Secretary Paulson’s threat changed his mind about invokingthat MAC clause and terminating the deal.Secretary Paulson has informed us that he made the threat at the request of Chairman Bernanke. After the threat, the conversation between Secretary Paulson and Lewis turned toreceiving additional government assistance in light of the staggering Merrill Lynch losses.so the big question i Have is the FED in charge og Goldman Sacks or is GS in charge of the Fed?

GuestApril 23rd, 2009 at 12:25 pm

Why Housing Is Not Coming Backhttp://www.businessinsider.com/why-housing-is-not-coming-back-2009-4Our summary of Charles Hugh Smith’s critique of the idea that we should be looking for a a recovery in the housing market to bubble valuations to “restart the economy” generated a lot of controversy. We’re not sure the summary did justice to Smith’s argument. With his permission, we give you his entire essay here. For more from Smith, go to his provocative website, OfTwoMinds.——————————————————————————–The entire world is hoping that housing is about to “recover” and re-ascend its glorious bubble-era heights of valuation. But it’s not going to happen.Why not? For several fundamental reasons:1. Bubbles do not re-inflate in the asset class which just popped. It is simply a truism that bubbles never reflate, ever. Tulip bulb valuations did not rise to stratospheric heights after the Tulip Craze popped, and the Nasdaq dot-com bubble did not reinflate, either, for the very good reason that bubbles are never based on rational valuations–they are based on the psychological state of mania which cannot be reinstated once lost.Consider tech stock Cisco Systems (CSCO), a well-managed “real company” which continues to make profits providing real-world goods and services. It currently trades at around $17.50 a share, down from its dot-com bubble valuation of about $81/share.To “recover” its bubble-era valuation, Cisco would have to rise five-fold. That’s not going to happen. Now that the mania has dissipated, Cisco is valued on more rational metrics like earnings, profits, etc.The speculative mania always moves on to a new asset class. After the dot-com bubble popped, the speculative bubble moved on to housing. Now that the housing bubble has popped, the mania has moved to the bond market. When the bond bubble bursts (it’s guaranteed that it will in the next two years, losing 50% or more in the process) then the only asset class which hasn’t already been blown into a bubble is precious metals/gold.In other words: those wishing to catch the next speculative mania should be buying gold and silver, not stocks, housing or bonds.2. Inflation sets the “recovery” target ever higher. While we are in a deflationary period right now, a serious amount of inflation occurred between Cisco’s top in January 2000 and the present. According to the BLS Inflation Calculator, $81 in 2000 is $100 in current dollars.So Cisco would have to rise not to $81 to match its bubble-era valuation but to $100. The same is true for housing. Consider the possibility many see on the horizon, a period of high inflation caused by the insanely stupendous rise in paper money supply.I am not predicting such an inflation, just speculating on the effects it would have on bubble-era valuation calculations.Let’s say a house which sold for $100,000 in 1997 was valued at $400,000 at the housing bubble peak in 2006. I fully expect the property to retrace to its pre-bubble valuation, as that is the usual progression of bubbles and their demise.Now if inflation ramps up and ravages the value of the dollar, the price of a tangible good like a home might well rise more or less along with inflation, as people will be trying to turn their rapidly devaluing dollars into some tangible good as a means of preserving wealth.But if inflation is clipping along at 10% a year and the house returns to its bubble-era value of $400,000, does the $400,000 retain the same purchasing power as $400,000 in 2006? No.For an example of how this works, consider the stock market in the inflationary period of the 1970s:While the stock market went from 1,000 in 1966 to 1,000 in 1982 14 years later, inflation destroyed 2/3 the value of the dollar. According to the BLS, $1 in 1966 was worth 34 cents in 1982, meaning those who held stocks for those 14 years did not retain their wealth as the Dow Jones remained at 1,000–they lost 2/3 of their wealth.It is easy to foresee the same thing happening in housing should inflation ignite. Over the next 14 years, the house which sold for $400,000 in 2006 may well rise once again to that nominal price, but the inflation-adjusted value could well be closer to $100,000 when priced in 1997 dollars.This is why nominal prices in stocks, housing, bonds and gold are essentially meaningless. All assets have to be valued in terms of purchasing power, and as imperfect and flawed as any inflation/deflation gauge might be, it’s still a better guide to purchasing power than nominal price.3. Perhaps counter-intuitively, deflation also ravages bubble-era valuations. You might think that if inflation is tough on bubble-era valuations when priced in purchasing power (or some non-paper metric like gold), then deflation would be dandy. But deflation wipes out bubble-era valuations just as assiduously as inflation.In deflation, debt grows ever more burdensome as money becomes more valuable and wages and income drop. As a result, assets dependent on debt ( that is, real estate) drop in value. In deflation, real estate become a “capital trap” which loses value as cash gains in value. As incomes plummet, so do rents, i.e. the income stream which real estate earns, further impairing its value.Deflation often accompanies depression, and nothing is more of a capital trap than an empty house or building earning zero income. Compared to that, cash earning interest looks very attractive. This creates another drag on housing valuations.So whatever the future holds, deflation or inflation (or periods of one following the other), housing will never return to its bubble-era valuations when measured by purchasing power/adjusted for inflation.4. The fundamental driver of the housing bubble was once-in-a-lifetime low interest rates and loose/fraudulent lending.Bond yields (and thus interest rates) tend to move in generational cycles of about 20 years– occasionally as short as 17 years and as long as 27 years. The current decline in yields has now run 27 years which the historical maximum for such cycles, and thus we can safely predict that yields and interest rates will be rising for the next generation.Why would interest rates rise? Easy–the U.S. is borrowing trillions of dollars a year and once the rest of the world either runs out of cash or the desire to give us all their surplus capital then interest rates will rocket regardless of what the Fed or U.S. Treasury do. (Recall the analogy of the Financial Royalty standing knee-deep in a rising tide demanding the waters recede. Good luck with that, fellas.)As for loose/fraudulent lending–you know the story already. It isn’t coming back.So if the fundamental drivers of insanely low interest rates and insanely loose lending are not coming back, then precisely what forces will reinflate the housing bubble? The answer is: none.Demographics? As noted here many times, housing density (number of people per structure) has been falling for decades. As density rises, all future population growth can be easily accomodated with the existing housing stock.Speculative mania? That circus came to Housing Town and left, never to return in our lifetimes (if you’re three years old you may live to see another housing bubble in your dotage).Those counting on a reinflation of housing to bubblicious heights to fuel another manic bout of borrow-and-spend will be sorely disappointed. Housing is never coming back if we define “coming back” as a return to bubble-top 2006 valuation as measured in purchasing power.

MM CAApril 23rd, 2009 at 12:34 pm

Here is the full letter…. Are we having fun yet? Talk about what our future movies and tv shows will be about…. a whole new genre for the entertainment industry… not to mention what the rest of the world thinks about us now…..STATE OF NEW YORK OFFICE OF THE ATTORNEY GENERAL 120 Broadway New York, NY 10271ANDREW M. CUOMO Attorney General(212) 416-8050April 23, 2009The Honorable Christopher 1. Dodd, Mary L. Schapiro, Chairman Chairman U.S. Securities and Exchange Commissionu.s. Senate Committee on Banking, Office of the ChairmanHousing, and Urban Affairs 100 F Street, NE 534 Dirksen Senate Office Building Washington, DC 20549 Washington, DC 20510Ms. Elizabeth Warren, Chair The Honorable Barney Frank, Chairman Congressional Oversight Panel House Financial Services Committee 732 North Capitol Street, NW Democratic Staff Rooms C-320 and C-617 2129 Rayburn House Office Building Mailstop: COP Washington, DC 20515 Washington, DC 20401Re: Bank of America -Merrill Lynch Merger InvestigationDear Chairpersons Dodd, Frank, Schapiro and Warren:I am writing regarding our investigation of the events surrounding Bank of America’s merger with Merrill Lynch late last year. Because you are the overseers and regulators of the Troubled Asset Relief Program (“TARP”), the banking industry, and the Treasury Department, we are informing you of certain results of our investigation. As you will see, while the investigation initially focused on huge fourth quarter bonus payouts, we have uncovered facts that raise questions about the transparency of the TARP program, as well as about corporate governance and disclosure practices at Bank of America. Because some matters relating to our investigation involve federal agencies and high-ranking federal officials charged with managing the TARP program, we believe it is important to inform the relevant federal bodies of our current findings. We have attached relevant documents to this letter for your review.On September 15,2008, Merrill Lynch entered into a merger agreement with Bank of America. The merger was negotiated and due diligence was conducted over the course of a tumultuous September 13-14 weekend. Time was of the essence for Merrill Lynch, as the company was not likely to survive the following week without a merger. The merger was approved by shareholders on December 5, 2008, and became effective on January 1,2009.The week after the shareholder vote -and days after Merrill Lynch set its bonuses Merrill Lynch quickly and quietly booked billions of dollars of additional losses. Merrill Lynch’s fourth quarter 2008 losses turned out to be $7 billion worse than it had projected prior to the merger vote and finalizing its bonuses. These additional losses, some of which had become known to Bank of America executives prior to the merger vote, were not disclosed to shareholders until mid-January 2009, two weeks after the merger had closed on January 1,2009.On Sunday, December 14,2008, Bank of America’s CFO advised Ken Lewis, Bank of America’s CEO, that Merrill Lynch’s financial condition had seriously deteriorated at an alarming rate. Indeed, Lewis was advised that Merrill Lynch had lost several billion dollars since December 8, 2008. In six days, Merrill Lynch’s projected fourth quarter losses skyrocketed from $9 billion to $12 billion, and fourth quarter losses ultimately exceeded $15 billion.Immediately after learning on December 14,2008 of what Lewis described as the “staggering amount of deterioration” at Merrill Lynch, Lewis conferred with counsel to determine if Bank of America had grounds to rescind the merger agreement by using a clause that allowed Bank of America to exit the deal if a material adverse event (“MAC”) occurred. After a series of internal consultations and consultations with counsel, on December 17,2008, Lewis informed then-Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson that Bank of America was seriously considering invoking the MAC clause. Paulson asked Lewis to come to Washington that evening to discuss the matter.At a meeting that evening Secretary Paulson, Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke, Lewis, Bank of America’s CFO, and other officials discussed the issues surrounding invocation of the MAC clause by Bank of America. The Federal officials asked Bank of America not to invoke the MAC until there was further consultation. There were follow-up calls with various Treasury and Federal Reserve officials, including with Treasury Secretary Paulson and Chairman Bernanke. During those meetings, the federal government officials pressured Bank of America not to seek to rescind the merger agreement. We do not yet have a complete picture of the Federal Reserve’s role in these matters because the Federal Reserve has invoked the bank examination privilege.Bank of America’s attempt to exit the merger came to a halt on December 21, 2008. That day, Lewis informed Secretary Paulson that Bank of America still wanted to exit the merger agreement. According to Lewis, Secretary Paulson then advised Lewis that, if Bank of America invoked the MAC, its management and Board would be replaced:[W]e wanted to follow up and he said, ‘I’m going to be very blunt, we’re very supportive on Bank of America and we want to be of help, but’ –as I recall him saying “the government,” but that mayor may not be the case -”does not feel it’s in your best interest for you to call a MAC, and that we feel so strongly,” –I can’t recall ifhe said “we would remove the board and management if you called it” or ifhe said “we would do it if you intended to.” I don’t remember which one it was, before or after, and I said, “Hank, let’s deescalate this for a while. Let me2talk to our board.” And the board’s reaction was of”That threat, okay, do it. That would be systemic risk.”In an interview with this Office, Secretary Paulson [argely corroborated Lewis's account. On the issue of terminating management and the Board, Secretary Paulson indicated that he told Lewis that if Bank of America were to back out of the Merrill Lynch deal, the government either could or would remove the Board and management. Secretary Paulson told Lewis a series of concerns, including that Bank of America's invocation of the MAC would create systemic risk and that Bank of America did not have a legal basis to invoke the MAC (though Secretary Paulson's basis for the opinion was e,ntirely based on what he was told by Federal Reserve officials).Secretary Paulson's threat swayed Lewis. According to Secretary Paulson, after he stated that the management and the Board could be removed, Lewis replied, "that makes it simple. Let's deescalate." Lewis admits that Secretary Paulson's threat changed his mind about invoking that MAC clause and terminating the deal.Secretary Paulson has informed us that he made the threat at the request of Chairman Bernanke. After the threat, the conversation between Secretary Paulson and Lewis turned to receiving additional government assistance in light of the staggering Merrill Lynch losses.Lewis spoke with individual Board members after his conversation with Secretary Paulson. The next day, December 22,2008, the Board met and was advised of Lewis's decision not to invoke the MAC. The minutes of that meeting listed the key points of Lewis's calls with Secretary Paulson and Chairman Bemanke:(i) first and foremost, the Treasury and Fed are unified in their view that the failure of the Corporation to complete the acquisition of Merrill Lynch would result in systemic risk to the financial system in America and would have adverse consequences for the Corporation; (ii) second, the Treasury and Fed state strongly that were the Corporation to invoke the material adverse change ("MAC") clause in the merger agreement with Merrill Lynch and fail to close the transaction, the Treasury and Fed would remove the Board and management of the Corporation; (iii) third, the Treasury and Fed have confirmed that they. will provide assistance to the Corporation to restore capital and to protect the Corporation against the adverse impact of certain Merrill Lynch assets: and (iv) fourth, the Fed and Treasury stated that the investment and asset protection promised could not be provided or completed by the scheduled closing date of the merger, January 1, 2009; that the merger should close as schedu[ed, and that the Corporation can rely on the Fed and Treasury to complete and deliver the promised support by January 20, 2009, the date scheduled for the release of earnings by the Corporation.The Board Minutes further state that the "Board clarify[ied] that is [sic] was not persuaded or influenced by the statement by the federal regulators that the Board and management would be3removed by the federal regulators if the Corporation were to exercise the MAC clause and failed to complete the acquisition of Merrill Lynch.”Another Board meeting was held on December 30,2008. The minutes of that meeting stated that “Mr. Lewis reported that in his conversations with the federal regulators regarding the Corporation’s pending acquisition of Merrill Lynch, he had stated that, were it not for the serious concerns regarding the status of the United States financial services system and the adverse consequences of that situation to the Corporation articulated by the federal regulators (the “adverse situation”), the Corporation would, in light of the deterioration of the operating results and capital position of Merrill Lynch, assert the material adverse change clause in its merger agreement with Merrill Lynch and would seek to renegotiate the transaction.”Despite the fact that Bank of America had determined that Merrill Lynch’s financial condition was so grave that it justified termination of the deal pursuant to the MAC clause, Bank of America did not publicly disclose Merrill Lynch’s devastating losses or the impact it would have on the merger. Nor did Bank of America disclose that it had been prepared to invoke the MAC clause and would have done so but for the intervention of the Treasury Department and the Federal Reserve.Lewis testified that the question of disclosure was not up to him and that his decision not to disclose was based on direction from Paulson and Bernanke: “I was instructed that ‘We do not want a public disclosure. ‘”Secretary Paulson, however, informed this Office that his discussions with Lewis regarding disclosure concerned the Treasury Department’s own disclosure obligations. Prior to the closing of the deal, Lewis had requested that the government provide a written agreement to provide additional TARP funding before the close of the Merrill Lynch/Bank of America merger. Secretary Paulson advised Lewis that a written agreement could not be provided without disclosure.Lewis testified that there was no discussion with the Board about disclosure to shareholders. However, on the night of December 22, 2008, Lewis emailed the Board, “I just talked with Hank Paulson. He said that there was no way the Federal Reserve and the Treasury could send us a letter of any substance without public disclosure which, of course, we do not want.” The December 30 Board meeting minutes further reflect that Bank of America was trying to time its disclosure of Merrill Lynch’s losses to coincide with the announcement of its earnings in January and the receipt of additional TARP funds: “Mr. Lewis concluded his remarks by stating that management will continue to work with the federal regulators to transform the principles that have been discussed into an appropriately documented commitment to be codified and implemented in conjunction with the Corporation’s earning [sic] release on January 20, 2009.”It also bears noting that while no public disclosures were made by Bank of America, Lewis admitted that Bank of America’s decision not to invoke the MAC clause harmed any shareholder with less than a three year time-horizon:4Q. Wasn’t Mr. Paulson, by his instruction, really asking Bank of America shareholders to take a good part of the hit of the Merrill losses?A. What he was doing was trying to stem a financial disaster in the financial markets, from his perspective.Q. From your perspective, wasn’t that one of the effects of what he was doing?A. Over the short term, yes, but we still thought we had an entity that filled two big strategic holes for us and over long term would still be an interest to the shareholders.Q. What do you mean by “short-term”?A. Two to three years.Notably, during Bank of America’s important communications with federal banking officials in late December 2008, the lone federal agency charged with protecting investor interests, the Securities and Exchange Commission, appears to have been kept in the dark. Indeed, Secretary Paulson informed this Office that he did not keep the SEC Chairman in the loop during the discussions and negotiations with Bank of America in December 2008.As this crucial recovery process continues, it is important that taxpayers have transparency into decision-making. It is equally important that investor interests are protected and respected. We hope the information herein is useful to you in your federal regulatory and oversight capacities and we remain ready to assist further in any way. We also note that we have been coordinating our inquiry with the Special Inspector General for the Troubled Asset Relief Program, whose investigation also remains open.AndrewM. CuomoAttorney General of the

economicminorApril 23rd, 2009 at 12:58 pm

You are probably right about oil as there is a bottom line cost in production. Shale oil has a high production cost and so does deep ocean drilling. So in some respects, the cost of production dictates the bottom line cost. When oil gets to cheap, major producers just go off line and lowers production and helps support the price.This argument is true for most resources, including food. So the bottom line is that many resources can only get so cheap, no matter what the underlying economies are doing. This doesn’t mean that they will rise in price though until the underlying demand is restored and that argument is still open as far as I’m concerned.One issue that many seem to leave out of their equations is the cost of debt and the fact that servicing it is already onerous for many. Resource costs are a factor in servicing debt as high resource costs act like a tax on income. The higher they remain, the less that incomes can go toward either paying debts or savings which will have to come before increasing consumption.As for using oil as a flight to safety, that argument is bogus as it is to hard to store oil. The real flight to safety will be in precious metals. This could include copper as that is a major industrial commodity used in almost all developmental projects.

TurtleApril 23rd, 2009 at 1:00 pm

Today Swat and Buner — tomorrow the world. The essence of that comment by a leading Taliban type has been hidden from view by the Main Stream Media. Your apple presents a clear and present danger to other parties certain.

PeteCAApril 23rd, 2009 at 1:13 pm

Guest: Frankly, we are amazed too! It’s very surprising that something big isn’t burning in our country. But Americans are getting very angry. Very likely we are headed towards a political future in the US where people may much less attention to Washington DC, and where there is a higher level of anarchy in society. The politicians will start to feel like they are “losing control” of the country.PeteCA

PeteCAApril 23rd, 2009 at 1:15 pm

3′rd sentence should have said: “Very likely we are headed towards a political future in the US where people pay much less attention to Washington D.C. …”PeteCA

GuestApril 23rd, 2009 at 1:36 pm

But what else must happen to ignite a little protest?Every idiot even in America now can see that everything in the Goverment and industry is corrupt.How much taxpayers money must this “elite” stealing before somebody stand up and burn D.C?

HayesApril 23rd, 2009 at 1:43 pm

I have CNBC on most of the day (computer) — They’ve always been perma bulls but the tone in the past six months has definitely changed – the fluff level has gotten out of hand with their bobble headed anchors and Jerry Springer like debates. I have suspected they were being given marching orders on how to report the economic crisis. It turns out that my suspicions may have had some merit. (I’ll be letting my CNBC subscription lapse and move to Bloomberg (even though their video quality sucks)”First up was a woman asking about a reported meeting in which CEO Jeff Immelt and NBC Uni CEO Jeff Zucker supposedly told top CNBC executives and talent to be less critical of President Obama and his policies.Immelt acknowledged a meeting took place but said no one at CNBC was told what to say or not to say about politics.During the woman’s follow-up question, her microphone was apparently cut off. A short time later, Waters asked a question and his mic was cut, too.”http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/hr/content_display/news/e3i888016761f9ec824f862a5c265de605c

MM CAApril 23rd, 2009 at 2:06 pm

at this rate there will be no tax money… Gov’t tax income is down 20% the past 6 months… If you are not working you are not paying tax. And if you are not buying (consuming) or producing, corporations are paying less tax too… The MODEL is broke now… Everyone seems to be fighting over a dwindling share of the pie…

Little SaverApril 23rd, 2009 at 2:16 pm

Don’t know the answer, but free markets seem nothing more than an illusion used by insiders to screw outsiders.

PeteCAApril 23rd, 2009 at 2:27 pm

Just a quick note to readers here, and some feedback to the folks at Contrary Investor.If you go to http://www.stockcharts.com and you type in $TNX and $TYX you can see the yields for the 10-year note and the 30-year bond.What’s unusual is this … if you look at the recent short-term data you’ll see that that $TNX has stabilized in a trading range around 2.9%-3% , and $TYX has stabilized around 3.6%-3.8%.This is actually pretty interesting stuff! You could cut out these short-term charts and make wallpaer from them. Why??? These rates are stabilizing because the Fed is TARGETING these rates as goals. At least, that’s my supposition. When the Fed adopts a QE strategy, da’ boyz at the Fed really go to town and target their goals. They are adjusting their intervention in the credit markets so that they target specific values for the rates on the 10-year and 30-year instruments. And you can see that they are effectively hitting these targets.You just gotta’ admire what those Fed men can do with a cuppa’ coffee and a few extra billlion in taxpayer dollars!!!It’s just interesting because in times gone by – these markets traded as free markets. Well, they’re not any more. The Fed is intervening and holding artificial rates. It means that the Fed is holding the yield curve in the USA to a fixed shape, and preventing the action of free market forces. I just mention this because I see some folks, even experienced ones, plotting technical charts on $TYX and $TNX are drawing conclusions. The game has changed. The rates have gone flat (with minor volatility).They can keep up this “hallucinogenic game” (thanks Gary Dorsch for that great phrase) aslong as they are willing to spend enormous sums of taxpayer dollars to undermine the free markets for credit. Apparently Ben Bernanke is not having any troubles with his conscience about this … so the game of credit markert magic goes on.PeteCA

devils advocateApril 23rd, 2009 at 2:33 pm

new game planget housing right and everything will improve: what if this were impossible to accomplish?tons of homeowners are exiting their homesDr. Roubini’s recommendation to cut mortgages by 15% is totally insufficientsomeone paying a $1700 a month mortgage payment for a $200,000 home-even if his mortgage is cut down 15% to $1500 a month, so what?he exits to an $800 a month rentalso what’s left?get the stock market up, then, everything will shoot up

devils advocateApril 23rd, 2009 at 2:37 pm

you and Dr. Roubini got the numbers right, but stocks will rise and rise like a hot-air balloonbeing fired up by more and more hot air (= hope and hype)

BrianApril 23rd, 2009 at 2:49 pm

Right, Pete. This is basically the fed end game. By fixing rates through bond purchases, the fed engages in the first part of the slippery slope of the ponzi scheme. Over time, low rates create huge gambles and inefficiencies, which will require ever increasing purchases of treasuries to maintain the target rates.There is no exit strategy whereby the fed can “mop up” the extra liquidity that it is creating. Quite the opposite, it will require exponentially more funding as time goes by.The end result is that at some point, there are too many dollars circulating. One or more major dollar holders will panic and sell dollars into gold, and the dollar collapse will occur. Hyperinflation materializes overnight, and the ponzi scheme collapses.–Brian

Farnorth5April 23rd, 2009 at 2:50 pm

Well said Guest.The Housing price will not return to the Bubble Value any time soon.Only serious Inflation will do the trick.I am always amused when people look at the Big Three stock values and say”They havent been this low since 1958″ etc.WRONG,WRONG,WRONG .Based on Inflation since 1958,you have to move the decimal over one place.(E.G. A current share price of $1.50 actually equals .15 cents in 1958 Dollars) What a fairy tale we witness and are expected to believe !!!!!

Brett in ManhattanApril 23rd, 2009 at 2:51 pm

Nah, stock market touts like CNBC need to be enthusiastic about the market; otherwise, no one would play it.

PeteCAApril 23rd, 2009 at 3:03 pm

BUT WHAT IF … ?What if, instead of throwing away trillions of dollars in bailout money, the US Government had done this instead …—————————-* US Auto Companies – Alternative StrategyWhat if the Gov’t had allowed GM, Ford and Chrysler to sink or swim in the free market (i.e. allowed bankruptcy if it happened) with no bailouts. BUT instead the Gov’t offered a special compensation package to all auto workers who lost their jobs – where they would get their same salary for 6 months, plus a travel relocation package to move to a new job.Chances are … this would have saved a lot of money compared to all that’s been spent on auto bailout plans.—————–* US Banking – Alternative StrategyWhat if the Government had allowed the big Wall Street banks to sink or swim (including going into receivership or outright bankruptcy) if they failed. MEANWHILE, instead the Gov’t had taken $1-2 trillion in taxpayer money and established a completely new system of commercial banks in the USA that were fully capitalized, had no involvement in financial derivatives, and were ready to make loans on properties, personal credit, and business loans?I’m not saying that a new banking system would have suddenly offered different loan rates (than existing banks). It wouldn’t. But let’s face it – the dollar amount to create a new system might have been far less than what has been paid to bail out the Wall Street banks. And after that, if the big guys on Wall Street fail – then they fail and their bond holders take the losses. Americans would still have had a viable alternative to place their money and have confidence. Even if the entire finasncial derivatives system ever went down, a new independent commercial banking system would have survived intact. [ To some extent - it still does today - but many commercial banks are suffering badly because of poor RE loan performance].The point is … there WERE sensible alternatives to the huge bailouts that were paid to Wall Street and Detroit. And these alternatives might have cost a lot less money. Americans have a legimitate right to ask what priorities are really determining policies in Washington D.C.PeteCA

GuestApril 23rd, 2009 at 3:22 pm

here is the linkhttp://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/even-jack-bauer-couldnt-stop/story.aspx?guid=%7BBE0D1772%2DA628%2D454D%2D80BF%2DC4484CEBA7DF%7D&dist=msr_2

GloomyApril 23rd, 2009 at 3:27 pm

ARMAGEDDON BEGINSBetween the automaker’s “bankruptcies” and the release of the overtly fradulently stress test results, the next few weeks should be very interesting, as we watch the tragicomic players in these charades on stage.DETROIT — The Treasury Department is preparing a Chapter 11 bankruptcy filing for Chrysler that could come as soon as next week, people with direct knowledge of the action said Thursday.The only major question that remains unresolved is what happens to Chrysler’s lenders, who hold $6.9 billion in company debt. The government’s most recent offer, presented Wednesday, would give the company’s lenders about 22 cents on the dollar, or $1.5 billion, and a 5 percent equity stake in a reorganized Chrysler. Earlier this week, a steering committee of the lenders proposed that they receive 65 cents on the dollar, or $4.5 billion, and a 40 percent equity stake.If no agreement is reached, a nasty legal fight could emerge in bankruptcy. The creditors’ claims are backed by virtually all of the company’s collateral, including plants, brands and equipment, and the lenders will argue that they have first claim on those assets.

Pecos BankerApril 23rd, 2009 at 3:53 pm

Won’t the high level of government borrowing crowd out all other debt and lead to a prolonged slump?

Farnorth5April 23rd, 2009 at 3:53 pm

Well ,how do you return housing to Bubble Values,when there are 19 Million housing units currently empty ?It seems like people try to cancel the laws of gravity or their equivalent .Just another financial fairy tale requiring financial fairy tale financing .Should we be going there ??What is the point ???

Pecos BankerApril 23rd, 2009 at 4:05 pm

Agree and notice that there is no discussion of accountability and transparency by Wolf. Nobody will have confidence if these two are not given the primacy they deserve. It’s all smoke and mirrors.

GuestApril 23rd, 2009 at 4:39 pm

@PeteCAYour point is well taken. Although my point is what us administration is saying openly is counterproductive. The local people in that part of the world think that statements coming out of us are a way of medling in thier own affairs. When secretary of state clinton says something and her stament is echoed by israely foriegn minister, who said that afghanistan pakistan situation is a bigger threat to israel than Iran is, than people connect the dots. There is already a overwhelming perception in that part of the world that us foreign policy is run by AIPAC(wrongly or rightly).So staements like this increase antiamericanism which as a result will strenthen taliban and will increase their public support. As far a swat and that area is concerned their is a long history of that. Let me give you some historical perspective. Pakistan gained independence from british in 1947. The swat wally was a mini state at the time. Evenhough that was included in pakistani teritorry but was semiautonomus and was ruled by their own waali(mini king)and was part of the fedrally administered tribal areas.(keep in mind that these tribal areas joined pakistan on a condition that pak govt will not meddle in their affairs). The swat vally had sharia law practiced in that vally for over two hundred years all the way uptil 1969. In 1969 swat people decided to become a formal part of pakistan on a condition that they will be allowed to keep on practicing sharia law instead of pakistani penal code system. But after few years pakistani law system was imposed on them. Intialy there was no resentment but as time passed the people became fed up with the pakistani justice system which could drag a case for years and years. People were used to quick and speedy justice system so than they said we are not happy with pakistani law and we want to go back to the sharia law. In 1990 a peaceful campaigne was started to demand sharia law from the govt.(Keep in mind by this time swat was a part of PATA not FATA. PATA= Provincialy administered tribal areas). In 1994 a securalar govt of benazir bhutto (current ruling party) signed a deal with the swat people to let them have sharia law. The deal didnt go well and again a deal was made in 1997 by another secular govt led by fmr prime minister nawaz sharif and shaia law was enacted in swat. In 1999 Musharaf overthrew nawaz sharif govt and came to power. He cancelled the deal and again and imposed pakistani law in swat. People in swat believed he did that on American pressure. That brings us to the present situation now Taliban ( a violent movement started by ignorant and illirette) are telling people that if you want to have a speedy and just system (Sharia Law) we will get it for you by armed strugle. They also claim that US and its allied govt in Islamabad is working agaisnt there interests. Since people are not educated they beleive their propaganda hence they protect them. That is not at all, the case in the educated and urban parts of pakistan. So when a US administration comes openly with these kind of statements its playing to the tune of Taliban hence increasing their support. As far as the perception in the west that Pak army is unnable to curb them is not true in my openion. Since Swat is a provincialy administered region the local provincial elected democratic secular govt wanted to sign a deal with taliban to bring peace in the region. army and the Fedral govt cannot enforce there will by force in a democratic system but i’m sure a time will come when people’s support will be there for the army to take a decissive action against taliban that is unless people in us govt act wisely and shed of the perception that they are palying in AIPAC hands. People in pakistan are fedup with the current justice system which they beleive is corupt and favors the rich and exploits the poor so i think US govt should pressure pak govt to have reforms in the justice system that will buy us goodwill. Also us is giving aid to pakistan which dont trickle down to ordinary people because of the corupt system.

GuestApril 23rd, 2009 at 4:41 pm

@PeteCAFrom AboveYour point is well taken. Although my point is what us administration is saying openly is counterproductive. The local people in that part of the world think that statements coming out of us are a way of medling in thier own affairs. When secretary of state clinton says something and her stament is echoed by israely foriegn minister, who said that afghanistan pakistan situation is a bigger threat to israel than Iran is, than people connect the dots. There is already a overwhelming perception in that part of the world that us foreign policy is run by AIPAC(wrongly or rightly).So staements like this increase antiamericanism which as a result will strenthen taliban and will increase their public support. As far a swat and that area is concerned their is a long history of that. Let me give you some historical perspective. Pakistan gained independence from british in 1947. The swat wally was a mini state at the time. Evenhough that was included in pakistani teritorry but was semiautonomus and was ruled by their own waali(mini king)and was part of the fedrally administered tribal areas.(keep in mind that these tribal areas joined pakistan on a condition that pak govt will not meddle in their affairs). The swat vally had sharia law practiced in that vally for over two hundred years all the way uptil 1969. In 1969 swat people decided to become a formal part of pakistan on a condition that they will be allowed to keep on practicing sharia law instead of pakistani penal code system. But after few years pakistani law system was imposed on them. Intialy there was no resentment but as time passed the people became fed up with the pakistani justice system which could drag a case for years and years. People were used to quick and speedy justice system so than they said we are not happy with pakistani law and we want to go back to the sharia law. In 1990 a peaceful campaigne was started to demand sharia law from the govt.(Keep in mind by this time swat was a part of PATA not FATA. PATA= Provincialy administered tribal areas). In 1994 a securalar govt of benazir bhutto (current ruling party) signed a deal with the swat people to let them have sharia law. The deal didnt go well and again a deal was made in 1997 by another secular govt led by fmr prime minister nawaz sharif and shaia law was enacted in swat. In 1999 Musharaf overthrew nawaz sharif govt and came to power. He cancelled the deal and again and imposed pakistani law in swat. People in swat believed he did that on American pressure. That brings us to the present situation now Taliban ( a violent movement started by ignorant and illirette) are telling people that if you want to have a speedy and just system (Sharia Law) we will get it for you by armed strugle. They also claim that US and its allied govt in Islamabad is working agaisnt there interests. Since people are not educated they beleive their propaganda hence they protect them. That is not at all, the case in the educated and urban parts of pakistan. So when a US administration comes openly with these kind of statements its playing to the tune of Taliban hence increasing their support. As far as the perception in the west that Pak army is unnable to curb them is not true in my openion. Since Swat is a provincialy administered region the local provincial elected democratic secular govt wanted to sign a deal with taliban to bring peace in the region. army and the Fedral govt cannot enforce there will by force in a democratic system but i’m sure a time will come when people’s support will be there for the army to take a decissive action against taliban that is unless people in us govt act wisely and shed of the perception that they are palying in AIPAC hands. People in pakistan are fedup with the current justice system which they beleive is corupt and favors the rich and exploits the poor so i think US govt should pressure pak govt to have reforms in the justice system that will buy us goodwill. Also us is giving aid to pakistan which dont trickle down to ordinary people because of the corupt system.

PeteCAApril 23rd, 2009 at 4:56 pm

Very good comments. Appreciated. I hope Hillary Clinton is reading your thoughts here.What do you think are the chances that people in Pakistan could significantly increase support for the MMA party, or other utlra-conservative religious parties?PeteCA

BobApril 23rd, 2009 at 5:03 pm

>>April 23 (Bloomberg) — U.K. government support for the banking system has risen to 1.4 trillion pounds ($2 trillion) and may climb higher as the financial crisis spreads to building societies and economists warn lenders may need more aid.<A simple apples to apples comparision – What is the banking size of the UK banking system to the US banking system? Mr. Roubini you may want to reconsider your estimates for the US.

HatesApril 23rd, 2009 at 5:04 pm

via ZHthis is actually a funny video”Treasury issues emergency recall of all US dollars”http://www.theonion.com/content/video/treasury_department_issues?utm_source=twittershare&utm_medium=twitter

GuestApril 23rd, 2009 at 5:33 pm

Thank You PeteCAI see that highly unlikely. But remember there was MMA govt in NWFP province for over 4 years but they did not enact sharia law in swat. In my openion only way relegiuos extremists can gain support is if there is no fair justice system in pakistan and there is no free judiciary ( keep in mind Dictator Pres. Musharaf was supported by US govt even though he changed constitution of the country and threw the cheif justice of the supreme court in jail. It is widely beleived that he would not have been able to do that without US support. Also you might find it interesting to know that the reason cheif justice was sacked was that he ordered musharaf govt to provide the court with whereabouts of some missing people in pakistan, who were assumed to be caught and handed over to US without any court approval an ilegal act under pakistani law :) )

PeterJBApril 23rd, 2009 at 5:39 pm

“We should nuke our banking industry instead and start from scratch…”@ MM CA on 2009-04-23 12:14:04I assume that you were speaking figuratively and or loosely, however this is how evolution pans out and we must learn from our mistakes; no mistakes, no learning, no evolution; nothing.I doubt that personalities say like Ben Benanke are bad people; I would without question, expect that he is a good, nay, very good man; and perhaps limited in his experience of the full flower of life, by his somewhat protected life’s environment (unlike some of us that bear scars upon scars), his nurtured belief system is its academic edifice, his national ‘faith’ by ivy covered malls and leather bound chairs imported from Italy and walnut covered walls and furniture, etc. Has Mr Benanke had the time and the opportunity to question the foundation of “economics’, that is, his chosen field of endeavour? Would such an undertaking brought him to where he is today? And, if he had found fault or error in past beliefs, the soundness of thesis by tenured Professors, the potential and moral hazard’s of political amusements, sport and wealth-building, or the continuing knocks at his door by the influential captains of industry, et al., demanding that he delivery the demands of lobby for the self-interests of all abound, then Mr Benanke would probably have found himself in some remote rooms, teaching some dumb kids, everything that they didn’t want to learn.However, Mr Benanke, using the Chairman of the FedRes as an example and hero of my muse, is influential and has huge resources at his disposal and I appeal to his academic ethic of heart and request of him that in the event that he has any doubt at all about that in which he has placed himself in full-employment, now is the time for him, that is to say, every opportunity is ripe for him, to utilize his powers and leverage to the fullest, for the benefit of all mankind, humanity, civilization and screw the goddamn (sorry Mom;) slobs of society, en masse, and unleash his powers of wisdom and creativity to bring about a new age of the human spirit.Why not? The USA is screwed anyway… he has got nothing to lose… he will probably eventually become the whipping boy of various groups of ghouls and elite feral… it would make him feel good and could make him a respected person and it could give humanity the new impetus – the new fundamental foundation – the consilient moment – that vital impetus, that makes history er, from grasping the soul-of-man from the jaws of the abyss.No, we don’t need to nuke anything but we do need to use our courage, honour and abilities, to evolve in dignity, with values; real values; honest values.Ho hum

SoftwarengineerApril 23rd, 2009 at 5:40 pm

LIPSTICK ON THE IMMINENT BIG THREE BANRUPTCY PIG?I assume Gloomy’s story was pulled from a Detroit Press contact on Chrysler’s bankruptcy; Obama is contradicting it. See the proof:http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20090423/ts_nm/us_chrysler_whitehouse;_ylt=AgvAc.IjD7m.5IjzzGUgnMNg.3QA;_ylu=X3oDMTJwN2dnY3U3BGFzc2V0A25tLzIwMDkwNDIzL3VzX2NocnlzbGVyX3doaXRlaG91c2UEY3BvcwMxBHBvcwMxBHNlYwN5bl90b3Bfc3RvcmllcwRzbGsDdXNvZmZpY2lhbGRpAlbeit the “U.S. official” that contradicts Gloomy’s story is unknown and has no name. LOLIts like the frog [We the People] boiled in water, if we keep the heat [news] from boiling it too fast, we won’t notice that imminent economic death draws near and jump terrified from the pan. Stocks went up today on the low temperature boil news….LOL

GuestApril 23rd, 2009 at 5:56 pm

Crap from Germany:Financial Times Germany Headline:US-Recession ends by years endThey are talkin about “Economic Instutions” which predicts this sh%$§t but dont tell us which.Maybe FT reporters are hallucinate.

PeteCAApril 23rd, 2009 at 6:14 pm

Guest – you know I realized I asked you the wrong question. Since the MMA is only a minority party, it seems unlikely they would gain large support quickly. So the real opinion I should be asking from you is this: What are the chances that the main political parties in Pakistan would shift their stance now and become much more anti-US in their position? That is probably the real risk – as far as US interests are concerned.PeteCA

GuestApril 23rd, 2009 at 6:46 pm

Last week’s issue of Barron’s included an interview with William Black, who served as deputy director of the Federal Savings and Loan Insurance Corp. during the thrift crisis of the 1980s. That article included these clear-sighted comments on reality of the situation:“We already know from the real costs — through the cleanups of IndyMac, Bear Stearns, and Lehman — that the losses will be roughly 50 to 80 cents on the dollar. The last thing we need is a further drain on our resources and subsidies by promoting this toxic-asset market. By promoting this notion of too-big-to-fail, we are allowing a pernicious influence to remain in Washington. The truth has a resonance to it. The folks know they are being lied to.“With most of America’s biggest banks insolvent, you have, in essence, a multitrillion dollar cover-up by publicly traded entities, which amounts to felony securities fraud on a massive scale. These firms will ultimately have to be forced into receivership, the management and boards stripped of office, title, and compensation. Right now, things don’t look good. The government is reluctant to admit the depth of the problem, because to do so would force it to put some of America’s biggest financial institutions into receivership. The people running these banks are some of the most well-connected in Washington, with easy access to legislators. Prompt corrective action is what is needed, and mandated in the law. And that is precisely what isn’t happening. The savings-and-loan crisis showed that, too often, the regulators became too close to the industry, and run interference for friends by hiding the problems.“We have lost the ability to be blunt. Now we have a situation where Treasury Secretary Geithner can speak of a $2 trillion hole in the banking system, at the same time all the major banks report they are well-capitalized. And you have seen no regulatory action against what amounts to a $2 trillion accounting fraud. The reason we don’t see it — aren’t told about it — is that if they were honest, prompt corrective action would kick in, and they would have to deal with the problem banks.”

GuestApril 23rd, 2009 at 7:20 pm

@ MM CA: “Secretary Paulson indicated that he toldLewis that if Bank of America were to back out of the Merrill Lynch deal, the government eithercould or would remove the Board and management… Secretary Paulson has informed us that he made the threat at the request of Chairman Bernanke.After the threat, the conversation between Secretary Paulson and Lewis turned toreceiving additional government assistance in light of the staggering Merrill Lynch losses…so the big question i Have is the FED in charge og Goldman Sacks or is GS in charge of the Fed?”I understand the reason for your question. In short, officials of the United States government and a private banking cartel picked out a company,Bank of America, and forced it into adversity for extraneous or personal reasons. Even if the deed was done for stability in the financial markets,to pick out a healthy company and force it to take on adversity jeopardizes the true intent of the Constitution and the laws of the United States.After all, BofA’s Board is sworn to serve the best interests of its stockholders. It’s one thing when B of A agreed to it,but another when B of A later found out that Merrill Lynch was padding the debt and lying about it.Surely only the Executive Branch, through the courts, could order such a thing, and then only if it had an affect on national securityor if it could be demonstrated through the courts that B of A was in violation of the law. Bernanke and Paulson actually commandeered Bank of America’sproperty on the promise they later would restore it using taxpayer money. Of course, the suspected reason for this exercise of raw power,in absence of any Congressional action, translates to the strong possibility that one of the Merrill Lynch debtors was Goldman Sachs.In other words, this is how to transfer taxpayer money to Goldman Sachs by way of Bank of America and Merrill Lynch, under the table.

Fritz HottingerApril 23rd, 2009 at 7:40 pm

Pete, maybe you can fill us in on the President’s Working Group, better known as the PPT, Plunge Protection Team.The stock market is not a free market either.PPT seems to be run by Secy of the Treasury, and his staff, charged to keep an “orderly stock market”.Appears that they control the closing level of the Dow and or SP 500 by actions on the futures markets in the closing minutes. Most evident on days when Obama speaks on the economy, and the market jumps 100 points in the final minutes.

MM CAApril 23rd, 2009 at 8:04 pm

I have to diasgree that the “use our courage, honour and abilities, to evolve in dignity, with values; real values; honest values” that 99.9% of most americans possess will change the way the PTB act. when so few will not listen to the majority and those that possess these good qualities do, whatever needs to be done should be done swiftly. As Pete CA says there were different things that could’ve been done and they were not. so yeah i say say nuke the banking system in one shot and start over.

MM CAApril 23rd, 2009 at 8:16 pm

I am getting nervous these days of what I see happeneing, especially in light of What I told people, family and friends i know over three years ago that this was all going to happen. Everyone said i was wrong. From the real estate collapse, to the Credit card problems, to the bank problems, to the auto problems, to the fact Average americans were swimming in debt, to the fact I saw massive unemployment coming… And back then I knew 5% of what I know now. And what I know now or believe will happen going forward would scare the dickens out of most people and I even refrain these days talking about what I see to most now because it’s so bad… It sucks waking up every day and seeing soemthing else bad happen knowing i knew it would happen in advance… and for the most part not being able to do a thing about it.

MM CAApril 23rd, 2009 at 8:20 pm

Who’s Going To Bail Out The FDIC?http://www.businessinsider.com/whos-going-to-bail-out-the-fdic-2009-4What timing.Last night, Bear Mountain Bull highlighted Mish’s post on the “woefully underfunded” FDIC, whose declining Deposit Insurance Fund (DIF) ratio has left it “ill prepared” to deal with future bank failures.Here’s a chart from Mish’s post which illustrates that decline:As outlined in the post above, this declining reserve ratio has (according to some) left the FDIC ill prepared to deal with the likely raft of upcoming bank failures. As you can see from the chart, the reserve ratio was at 0.40 percent as of December 31, 2008, down from an already low 1.01 percent level and below its legally mandated funding level of 1.15 percent.And as Mish points out, these figures don’t even take into account the FDIC’s temporary boost in bank account coverage to $250,000. So isn’t that a bit of a problem, especially since more bank failures are expected throughout the year?Well, not really, according to Bankrate.com. In an October 16, 2008 article entitled, “How the FDIC pays for bank failures” (which I just happened to be reading the other day while reading up on bank insurance), Bankrate’s Laura Bruce explains that the money will just have to come from the US Treasury:”…Christopher Whalen, co-founder and managing director at Institutional Risk Analytics, as well as a writer and former investment banker, says the FDIC will always be able to reimburse customers for their insured deposits.”The FDIC is like any federal agency; the government runs on cash. Money comes in and money goes out and each of these little funds gets a piece of paper that says I owe you money plus accrued interest. But really, in most cases, it just evidences legal authority to spend money. In the case of the FDIC, it merely evidences funds paid in by the industry, minus losses. But it’s still just a theoretical balance because it doesn’t reflect at all the cash available to the agency to fund resolutions.”As long as the FDIC has a positive balance in the fund, the agency is just asking for the industry’s money back. If that money is gone, the FDIC runs a tab at the Treasury because, by law, it has borrowing authority.Traditionally, the FDIC’s borrowing authority at the Treasury is limited to $30 billion, but Congress bestowed unlimited borrowing authority temporarily as part of the Emergency Economic Stabilization Act of 2008.”So there you have it. It’s all good; if there’s not enough money in the till, they’ll just get the money from the Treasury. But where does the Treasury get the money from?In the meantime, small banks are feeling the pinch from special assessment fees that the government wants to levy on them for the purpose of refilling the FDIC coffers. Note the irony: a large percentage of those funds were spent last year dealing with the failure of larger banks like IndyMac.Meanwhile, the FDIC collected no insurance premiums from most banks from 1996-2006. Given all the information about the agency’s precarious financial condtion, the question becomes: who will bailout the FDIC if it becomes insolvent?

jugglingcdosApril 23rd, 2009 at 8:31 pm

i know what Tyler Durden (egoistic, machoistic, anarchist, genius character from Fight Club) would say to you,now youre free…or maybe, something about bald space monkeys…at the end of the movie, Tyler Durden blew up several banks HQs.. everything resetsimagine the chaos

nondaApril 23rd, 2009 at 8:47 pm

The goverment has put trillions of dollars in hands of the same people that brought us into this mess, don’t you think they have something to gain. Obama is not an angel nobody is as charismatic as he may and has won everyone over, he still has an agenda to fill and if not all his then the people that put him there.U.S politics, Wall Street, power and money are all on the same boat the corruption and manipulation will always surround them at the expense of the people. It’s no longer the country as a whole that that will impose it’s dominance to the rest of the world to be competitive in every aspect but just a fist full of people that are high up in the country. The financial markets will cheat themselves to rise again and create wealth for those who are in the loop until it all comes crashing down again…when we don’t know. Financials were bleeding severely about three months ago and with the economy still in shambles they announce “record” earnings WOW!!! Makes you think that the rest of the sectors need do the same creative accounting for the DOW to reach 14000 S&P 1400 nasdaq 2300. I htink you get my point.God bless honest men with integrity like Nouriel for speaking the truth

MM CAApril 23rd, 2009 at 8:48 pm

Nah… information and knowledge lead to correct planning and decisions.. unlike others I have saved for this rainey day, while most continue to ignore the obvious… But i still have compassion for those around me i see suffereing or wondering what they will do… and that goes for msot good americans… violence in the end solves nothing…

MM CAApril 23rd, 2009 at 8:53 pm

This collapse is different, the power of the internet and all of us “reporters” make it impossible for the PTB to get away with what they ahve done the last 20-30 years. Oabama himself knows all to well the power of the internet and the “new mainstream media” which now resides in most American households. the game is over for the PTB, they just dont understand it yet and are putting up a valient fight…

GuestApril 23rd, 2009 at 9:18 pm

You, and many others here, seem significantly more bearish than Professor Roubini. I’m plenty worried, and I don’t think I underestimate the worst case possibility, but it’s a little hard to take the “knowing” seriously… what reads like a confidence in some writings here about the extreme dismal prospects for the future.Having said that, I also want to say: MM CA, you’re one of the posters here I most like reading, and I usually agree with most of what you write. I just hope we’re wrong, and there are some little and not-so-little reverse black swans, or something, ahead.

ChignosApril 23rd, 2009 at 9:23 pm

Hey Tom Hartman, you might as well sign your name to your words. The only reason anyone listens to you is to stay abreast of what the left demagogues are spouting.

ChignosApril 23rd, 2009 at 9:31 pm

You can’t call Barney Frank and tell him what to do……..but you can call the guy who ran a male prostitution ring from Barney’s basement. That might buy you some influence.

MM CAApril 23rd, 2009 at 9:43 pm

Bearish, bullish… no such thing… this is not cnbc or these days even Fox… they have been spewing the same BS tune for far too long… i like to think i am a realist and see what is front of me.. the stock market is irrevant to me these days… it means nothing…. all i know is 35 million om food stamps, approx 55 million with no health coverage, 20 million unoccupied housing units, millions of more forclusres coming, pension plans of all types trillions undefunded now, New car sales approaching “only” 8M annually now, SS and medicare 60 Trillion in unfunded liabilties, approx 15-20 million unemployed (depending how you count) another 40 million making less than 40k annually…. Im not “bearish” and wish this was jsut a dream and none of it was true, but i look around and see it every day out here in gorund zero (calif). i have a 21 year old graduating from college next month and her little sister is just turned two and those are the ones i worry for, actually all the kids and future kids…. and knowing all i know and “having” some $$$ to do soemthing with I still cant come up with what even my own kids should do or want to do with their own careers or what the 2 year old will do… kind of sucks that so many options have been stolen from us, escpecially the last 10-15 years…. Reality and truth some take as “bearish” or negative, but i would welcome good news and plans that address the 150 Trillion dollar problem i mentioned above… and not jsut BS but substantial ideas…. not buidling freaking high speed railroads or cutting 110 million of govt waste….

MM CAApril 23rd, 2009 at 10:15 pm

You gotta see the picture…. of him snoozing… Obama doesnt need this crap…lol – i cant stop laughing….http://www.businessinsider.com/larry-summers-falls-asleep-during-meeting-with-credit-card-execs-2009-4Larry Summers Snoozes Through Meeting With Credit Card ExecsJay Yarow|Apr. 23, 2009, 3:41 PM|9PrintTags: Economy, Politics, Credit CardsEither Larry Summers is overworked, or credit card executives are real boring.While they were convened to talk shop with the president and his cohorts, they manage to put the director of the National Economic Council to sleep.Marc Ambinder at The Atlantic: According to a pool report, Summers nodded off at the gathering of administration and credit card company officials, “doing the head on the hand and then head falling off the hand thing,” as observed by Keith Koffler, White House reporter for Roll Call.

ChignosApril 23rd, 2009 at 10:21 pm

It was only a fair interview. The problem with Democrats is they won’t give up failing pet programs. Roosevelt is seen as their great hero, but Social Security is aPonzi scheme and everyone knows it. Ditto for LBJ’s Medicare, for Obama’s impending socialized medicine. People who vote for their own free lunch at someoneelse’s expense insist that their own Ponzi be protected. The Republicans have long-since co-opted Wilson’s ultimate Ponzi scheme, the Federal Reserve.It’s starting to get a little hilarious now though because the chickens are really coming home to roost. The mother of all Ponzi schemes is the Federal Reserve Note.When that house of cards starts to fall, all these other pet programs will become just another unfunded federal proposal, each a no child left behind. The socialsafety net is and always was an illusion. If you want to be wise, you’ll start to think like a real American and plan to fend for yourself without government aid of any kind.

MarkApril 23rd, 2009 at 10:25 pm

Tom Hartman didn’t post. If you’re wanting to talk to him I think you need to try another site…Mark

MarkApril 23rd, 2009 at 10:27 pm

I’ve mentioned this in the past, but I’ll repeat it again: if THEY get ALL of the money then what could they possibly do? That would mean that the majority of people wouldn’t be participating with their fiat money!They are trying to keep the system from collapsing, that’s their real aim. And during the last days they’ll facilitate as much smoke as possible, but in the end they will fail, as will any other system that promotes growth.Mark

ChignosApril 23rd, 2009 at 10:31 pm

Of course Bernanke is lying. You think a smart banker like Ken Lewis would take on a stinking Merrill Lynch (and don’t forget:before that he took on a stinking Countrywide) without assurances that B of A would be treated as too big to fail by Bernanke?Gimme a break. Plenty of people watching the market knew this instinctively when Bernanke and Lewis met before the Countrywide deal.But ask yourself this: isn’t the real reason why Bernanke is still denying it (even though Paulson can’t because he got under oath,and probably no longer cares because he’s out of the line of fire) is…….BECAUSE THE WHOLE SCHEME IS NOT WORKING.People on this blog ought to start getting their heads around what they’re going to do when all these central banking machinationscome crashing down around their Federal Reserve Notes.

blind birdApril 23rd, 2009 at 10:34 pm

http://www.countercurrents.org/parenti230109.htm……“In sum, free-market corporate capitalism is by its nature a disaster waiting to happen. Its essence is the transformation of living nature into mountains of commodities and commodities into heaps of dead capital. When left entirely to its own devices, capitalism foists its diseconomies and toxicity upon the general public and upon the natural environment–and eventually begins to devour itself.The immense inequality in economic power that exists in our capitalist society translates into a formidable inequality of political power, which makes it all the more difficult to impose democratic regulations.If the paladins of Corporate America want to know what really threatens “our way of life,” it is their way of life, their boundless way of pilfering their own system, destroying the very foundation on which they stand, the very community on which they so lavishly feed.”

PeteCAApril 23rd, 2009 at 10:36 pm

Fritz – I’ll post some thoughts on the PPT tomorrow.Busy tonight, but I’ll get back to you.PeteCA

MarkApril 23rd, 2009 at 10:42 pm

I’ll cast my vote that you’re an operative of the GOP. I’m really tiring of political blovating.Mark

ChignosApril 23rd, 2009 at 10:44 pm

Pete,Always good posts. My question to you is this: when the Ponzi Federal Reserve Note collapses (when Americans lose faith in Bernanke’s Fed)what will America’s money become? Roosevelt outlawed the ownership of gold for US citizens–the ban lasted ’til 1972–I’m sure Obama willdo that if Bernanke’s Fed can’t reblow up Barney Frank’s bubble. How about rare coins? Guns? Ammunition? Cocaine? Heroin?Your thoughts.

jugglingcdosApril 23rd, 2009 at 10:45 pm

wow!!again wow,China sees EU as mere pawnexcerpt:-Vladimir Lenin, founder of the Soviet Union, once said that “the capitalists will sell us the rope with which we will hang them”. These days, it is China selling the rope and a disunited Europe that is in danger of hanging.WOW!!Trade barrier, import tariffs Here We Come…http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/bece5f40-2f5a-11de-a8f6-00144feabdc0%2Cs01%3D1.html?nclick_check=1Global Insight: China sees EU as mere pawnBy Tony Barber in BrusselsPublished: April 22 2009 17:40 | Last updated: April 22 2009 19:49Viewed from Brussels, China’s importance to the world’s security and economic systems has never been greater. Viewed from Beijing, the European Union’s importance has rarely been smaller.This imbalance will be on display in Prague on May 20, when EU and Chinese leaders get together for a summit. The meeting should have been held last December, but in an imperious gesture the Chinese cancelled it after Nicolas Sarkozy, France’s president, showed “disrespect” by arranging talks with the Dalai Lama, Tibet’s exiled spiritual leader.For the Europeans, it is something of a relief that the Chinese plan to show up in Prague. For the Chinese, it is something of an irrelevance that the summit is happening at all.China once seemed to take the EU as an institution more seriously, largely because of its apparent potential as a counter-balance to US global hegemony.But the world financial turmoil and wars in Afghanistan and Iraq have dealt a staggering blow to the US image as an unchallenged colossus striding the world.

MarkApril 23rd, 2009 at 10:55 pm

The Taliban are a tool of the elites. “Bad guys” are essential: and we’ve been brainwashing people for a long time that the “Rag Heads” are bad (refer to Hollywood’s depiction over the years).I’ll accept the general statement that the stability of the world is decreasing (though it has only ever been a thin veneer giving the appearance of stability- mainly only good as long as the US had bullets), but your specifics, and insistence on leading any political conversations away from Israel is beginning to make me believe that your views are highly skewed- just my opinion: but I tend to be right; the 9/11 demolition discussion is a pretty good case in point.Mark

MarkApril 23rd, 2009 at 10:59 pm

And to THAT I totally agree!It was built on a non-productive model that requires massive growth (consumption of resources). D-O-O-M-E-D!Mark

ChignosApril 23rd, 2009 at 11:00 pm

Good grief take off he rosy colored glasses! History teaches that when the idealists foment a revolution and provoke a collapse/big government change…..more often than not what replaces the previous system is one even more corrupt and dictatorial than the last. We’re in for such a revolution, there’sno doubt about that…..and there is absolutely no stopping it. So if you want to be part of it you better really put on your thinking cap and start planningto fight for something better, because if you don’t………you’ll probably get old wishing for the good old dys when federal taxes were “only” 28%.America is an anomaly in human history. From our revolution something better than the old order came out of it. Wise men attempted to give us apower-balanced republic (note: I did not say democracy or parliament, I said republic). We have the history to guide our decisions. Let’s not be naiivethinking we won’t need to fight to regain the freedoms we’ve lost.

ChignosApril 23rd, 2009 at 11:06 pm

Not only that….money can’t but you love.C’mon, MM CA, Is it all about money?Where’s your spiritual life?

MarkApril 23rd, 2009 at 11:16 pm

I’d love to hear from London Banker what his thoughts are. Also would like to hear what he now has to say after once proclaiming that Britain’s strategy was a lot more sound. I’m not saying this to ridicule, but to try and understand what went wrong in his analysis, which I thought was sound.Mark

MarkApril 23rd, 2009 at 11:42 pm

“Just listen to me and send in all the money” LOL!But that’s basically what’s happening!Mark

MarkApril 23rd, 2009 at 11:49 pm

Ah ha! There it is, the real underlying reason- TAXES!WRONG, it’s because the SYSTEM is predicated on growth. It IS a Ponzi scheme, and no matter who is in charge (be it all of us or only one dictator) the same results will occur.”America” was the last great exploitable region. Lots of fancy B.S. was spewed to make us believe that we were special (same origin as every other nation). The REAL “American,” the indigenous ones, didn’t think that our system was so grand/noble.Answer this: when you’re neck deep in toxic crap (from growth) what freedoms will you have?Mark

GuestApril 24th, 2009 at 12:03 am

Guest writes: “You, and many others here, seem significantly more bearish than Professor Roubini. I’m plenty worried, and I don’t thinkI underestimate the worst case possibility, but it’s a little hard to take the “knowing” seriously…what reads like a confidence in some writingshere about the extreme dismal prospects for the future.”Martin Wolf above references some of these “dismal prospects” in a chart from the National Bureau of Economic Research entitled“Wages and Human Capital in the US Financial Industry 1909-2006.” Perhaps no other visual used in the last 20 to 30 years more depictsthe takeover of America’s corporate profits by the financial sector. The chart is incredible; it shows how much the financial sectors makeswhen it is not regulated. It shows America to be in a significantly different economic situation from any she has ever encountered.It might change your mind about what lies ahead in America’s economic future.Says Wolf regarding the chart: “Unquestionably, we have witnessed a massive rise in the significance of the financial sector.In 2002, the sector generated an astonishing 41 per cent of US domestic corporate profits. In 2008, US private indebtedness reached295 per cent of gross domestic product, a record, up from 112 per cent in 1976, while financial sector debt reached 121 per cent of GDP in 2008.Average pay in the sector rose from close to the average for all industries between 1948 and 1982 to 181 per cent of it in 2007.This chart is one of the most significant charts in chart history. It tracks the growth in the U.S. financial sector’s wages to theFinancial Deregulation Index; and shows the accompanying share of the financial sector’s take of domestic corporate profits as deregulation sets in.If you look at the financial sector’s increased share of the economy through the years you will realize that Bernanke’s Fedis not the kind of central bank operation that even the most severe of Fed critics have feared these many years. This is more of a financial takeover.America has turned a corner.Here again is the link to the Wolf article and the NBER chart:http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/09f8c996-2930-11de-bc5e-00144feabdc0.html

Merriam WebsterApril 24th, 2009 at 12:34 am

“Bearish, bullish… no such thing…”That’s silly.”marked by, tending to cause, or fearful of falling prices (as in a stock market) b: pessimistic”http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/bearish

MarkApril 24th, 2009 at 12:40 am

I didn’t comment about “wealth,” in which case why do you want me to define it? But, I’ll do so anyway…Wealth is whatever one wishes to define it as. How’s that for circular?Wealth is health, it’s the position of not being in (constant/frequent) pain.Any materialistic definition is immaterial.Mark

subgeniusApril 24th, 2009 at 2:09 am

This collapse is different because we lack the resources to continue in the manner to which we are accustomed.

PeterJBApril 24th, 2009 at 2:35 am

@ Blindman and Markblindman, I take your point and of course you are correct but only to a point.humans differ according to function where some can do some things well and other things are beyond their scope while others, well, you get the point…and while5% of the population are capable and ept across the broad spectrum… so, my point is that we as a global society must recognize our attributes and skills and build upon the acknowledgment of these facts. We are one species…”leadership”, that is real “leadership” should recognize this (it’s in all the damned books (Sorry Mom:) and build social organization (and structure) accordingly; to our strengths as well as to our our weaknesses.Sometimes I think we need an aggressive race of aliens to attack Earth to make us grow up! Sigh.We can’t (don’t need to) make criminals out of ourselves – we just need to indulge in some scientific realities.Those “paladins” – on our side – are our strengths…I apologize if I don’t articulate my point clearly.Ho hum

Brett in ManhattanApril 24th, 2009 at 3:01 am

The late great Richard Ney said it best back in 1974, “The Fed is an instrument of the financial establishment.”

GuestApril 24th, 2009 at 5:47 am

helpcan anyone tell me how i can display the whole page on screen so i dont have to scroll left and right? Thank You

PeterJBApril 24th, 2009 at 5:49 am

“Now, argues Prof Johnson, the weight of the financial sector is preventing resolution of the crisis. Banks “do not want to recognize the full extent of their losses, because that would likely expose them as insolvent … This behaviour is corrosive: unhealthy banks either do not lend (hoarding money to shore up reserves) or they make desperate gambles on high-risk loans and investments that could pay off big, but probably won’t pay off at all. In either case, the economy suffers further, and, as it does, bank assets themselves continue to deteriorate – creating a highly destructive cycle.”Comment: For Simon Johnson, former chief economist at the International Monetary Fund and a professor at the Sloan School of Management at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology – to make such a statement, is a fairly strong break with his past… something that I have invited Prof. Benanke to do in my above post. But, it takes a certain amount of courage to return to becoming a human being again after a lifetime of serving the consensus oriented bureaucracy of academia.Ho hum

jugglingcdsApril 24th, 2009 at 6:14 am

137 people, if im right its already an epidemic…http://www.cbc.ca/health/story/2009/04/23/respiratory-illness-flu-mexico.htmlTravel advisory warns of severe respiratory illness in Mexico20 die from severe respiratory illness in MexicoCanadians who have recently returned from Mexico should be on alert for flu-like symptoms that could be connected to a severe respiratory illness, federal health officials said Thursday in issuing a travel advisory.A severe respiratory illness appears to have infected 137 people in south and central areas of Mexico, with cases concentrated in Mexico City and three other areas, including 20 deaths, the Public Health Agency of Canada said.In the United States, health officials in Texas and California were scrambling this week to deal with a new strain of swine flu, which has been diagnosed in seven people.The states share a border with Mexico not far from a town where two deaths were reported.The U.S. cases are unusual, because it appears none of the patients had contact with pigs, and the virus is one that health officials have never seen before.

HayesApril 24th, 2009 at 7:24 am

via NC“Catastrophic to Awful!” – The Banking Spin Cyclehttp://www.eurointelligence.com/article.581+M52ca24c9961.0.html

NoviceApril 24th, 2009 at 8:03 am

where do you live?? Here where I live clothing has gone up, food prices up, furniture-up.Dining out hasn’t gotten cheaper either, though there are some cheaper menu items, that difference is made up elsewhere on the menu. Salon services are up here too. Not to mention property taxes and sales tax is up as well, everything is up except maybe housing which has stayed level here and is only now coming down slightly, and cars. I don’t see much in regards to deflation on things I spend my money on.

NoviceApril 24th, 2009 at 8:34 am

http://www.moneyandmarkets.com/big-bank-profits-are-bogus-massive-public-deception-33228“Big bank profits are bogus! Massive public deception!” by Martin D. Weiss, Ph.D. 04-20-09Just wondering if some of you more economically endowed could let me know if this article is a fair representation of what is really going on in the banking sector. (Sorry I don’t know how to link to the article- perhaps someone could do so for me)I would like to share it with others but want to make sure that it is an accurate picture of the current situation first.Thanks in advance

GuestApril 24th, 2009 at 9:10 am

Yep! And the market rally continues. Any idea when the institutional buyers will turn off the lights and reverse course?

GuestApril 24th, 2009 at 9:19 am

Please take advantage of Hayes’s Post of Satyagit Das. Read it carefully!The last couple of pages talks about distributional coalitions influencingpolicy to the extent that they benefit and the population suffers. Reformcannot take place when the distributional coalitions block reform.It is the banks or us! You chose who will survive!Thank you Hayes!

MM CAApril 24th, 2009 at 9:20 am

I would say he is not far off… The risks still exist at these institutions that played in all the risky loans over the past 10 years. The accounting they ahve used are nothing but accounting tricks to show all these bogus porfits or lack of loss. form my understanding these are all one time gimmicks also, so msot of them sghould get exposed in the next quarter. its what i have been saying for a long time, everyone lives day to day hoping to fight and survive another day…. too many econimists are syaing the same basic things for the risk exposures not to be true, even the IMF has said so this past week….

GuestApril 24th, 2009 at 9:33 am

That sort of sums up America’s problem, doesn’t it–a bought-and-paid-for Congress “allowing a pernicious influence to remain in Washington”guilty of “felony securities fraud on a massive scale,” engaged in a $2 trillion accounting fraud” after having seized total control of theU.S.Treasury and the nation’s money supply?

GuestApril 24th, 2009 at 9:59 am

Speaking of Martin Wolf — this yesterday… FT.comA chancellor flying on a wing and a prayer by Martin WolfApril 22, 2009 –Only Alistair Darling, most emollient of politicians, could manage to make this Budget boring.He is telling his country that its prosperity was as fraudulent as a collateralised debt obligation, that Gordon Brown’s boastsof “no more Tory boom and bust” are a joke, that the forecasts he gave only last November were nonsense, that the public financesare deteriorating at a rate never seen in peacetime and that, to cover these failures, he is indulging in populist attacks on thehighly paid. To make this feel boring is an achievement.Yet is the government at last being realistic about the scale of this disaster? Can Labour hope to get away with it, economically or politically?Does it deserve to do so? These are the questions for markets and analysts now, and for voters at some point in the next 12 months.My answers are, briefly: No, No and NoIn terms of the overall picture, the salient figures were already well known: instead of an economic contraction of 1 per cent this year forecastin the pre-Budget report, the Treasury now forecasts a decline of 3.5 per cent; instead of public sector net borrowing of 8 per cent of grossdomestic product this financial year and 6.8 per cent next year, falling to 2.9 per cent in 2013-14, we now have 12.4 per cent this year,followed by 11.9 per cent next year and 5.5 per cent in 2013-14; and instead of net debt at 57 per cent of GDP in 2013-14, we now have net debtat 79 per cent.This is a horror story. But it could, of course, be worse: the economy may not recover as hoped; losses on support for the banks could, as theInternational Monetary Fund suggests, be far bigger than the 3.5 per cent of GDP now expected; and, above all, the creditworthiness of the Britishgovernment could come into question, with devastating consequences. The government is flying on a wing and a prayer. Can it – or its successor – landthe aircraft? As a British citizen, I do hope so. But nobody can now be sure of this. Can a government that made large claims for the quality of itsstewardship survive such a debacle?Perhaps the most striking single figure in the Budget is that the Treasury now believes cyclically adjusted net borrowing will be 9.8 per cent of grossdomestic product this financial year (see chart). In other words, virtually all of the overall net borrowing requirement of 12.4 per cent of GDP is structural.The Treasury’s implicit view is that this is a sudden and unexpected event, consequent on the collapse of corporate profitability, particularly in thefinancial sector, and of the housing market: it shows the structural net borrowing requirement at only 2.7 per cent in 2007-08 and 5.7 per cent in2008-09. But this view is highly implausible. More realistic is that, as happened in the boom of the late 1980s, but on a bigger scale, the Treasuryconfused a super-boom with a sustainable economic position. Now, after the collapse, the Treasury admits that the structural fiscal position is farworse than it thought. If it – and, we must admit, many others – had realised how fragile the economic and fiscal position was, they would haverecognised that deficits and net public debt were far too high.So the big question is how – and how quickly – the Treasury expects this appalling structural position to improve. The answer is: very slowly.By 2013-14, structural net borrowing is still expected to be 4.5 per cent of GDP and the structural current budget (supposed to be in balance “overthe cycle” under now discarded fiscal rules) will still run a deficit of 3.2 per cent of GDP. In this Budget, the cyclically adjusted current budgetreturns to balance only in 2017-18, instead of 2015-16, the date chosen in the November pre-Budget report.Yet any notion of the structural as opposed to the cyclical position is heroic guesswork. It may be sensible, therefore, to ignore the distinctionand focus on the plausibility of actual numbers. In essence, the Budget forecasts that, as a result of the collapse in GDP and the recession,particularly the huge rise in spending on benefits, total spending will peak at 48.1 per cent of GDP next year, but then fall to 39 per cent by 2017-18.Meanwhile, receipts make a modest recovery, from a crisis-hit 35.1 per cent of GDP this financial year and 36.2 per cent next year,to 38 per cent in 2013-14 and, presumably, thereafter.Behind this forecast is a promise and a hope: the promise is that real public spending will remain roughly constant between 2010-11 and 2013-14 andthen rise at only about 0.5 per cent a year over the rest of that parliament and, implicitly, well into the next; the hope is that the economy willrecover vigorously, with GDP already growing at 3.5 per cent in 2011, after 1.25 per cent next year. These are not impossible forecasts. But theyimply a resolution that can hardly be expected of any UK elected government, a vigour that can no longer be assumed of the storm-tossed Britisheconomy and an amount of luck, on the world economy and losses in the raddled banking system, that cannot be taken for granted. The horrible truthis that the government’s forecasts are still very far from the worst imaginable.I have no idea whether the government can both get away with this optimism and postpone the moment of truth at least until after the general election.Markets have been forgiving. The difficulty with assuming that this will continue is that this is how markets tend to behave – until they cease to do so.Should investors decide that a return to fiscal stability has become a remote prospect, they may turn against the UK suddenly and brutally. The populismof the Budget, with its fiscally futile attack on relatively high earners, makes this even more likely.Finally, does the government deserve to get away with it? It is true that this is a global crisis in which many economies have been as hard hit as the UK.But, according to the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development, no other big member has suffered as large a deterioration in itsstructural fiscal position as the UK. In retrospect, the government was far too optimistic about the structural solidity of the UK economy and itsfinances. While many others were equally blind, it is hard for a government to escape responsibility for so huge a mistake.I have sympathy for the decision not to tighten fiscal policy during the worst of a recession. But I would also want to see determination to takethe measures needed to return the fiscal position to health by the end of the next parliament. This will require action on both revenue and spending.Understandably, perhaps, the chancellor failed to spell out the scale of the challenges that lie ahead even if the economy were to recover robustly.Yet what is in prospect is year after miserable year of austerity.The challenge for both government and the opposition is to show how they will bring the budget back under control. Neither side is being honest aboutwhat this means. If this failure leads to a collapse of confidence, that will prove the worst mistake of all.http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/28796910-2f3f-11de-b52f-00144feabdc0.html

GuestApril 24th, 2009 at 10:08 am

I’m on the same terrain. We’ll just have to read sidewinder until the next thread, unless someone explains how to reduce the screenimage. Glitchs happen.

economicminorApril 24th, 2009 at 10:18 am

What do you mean by getting housing right?The right price in a free market is when an able willing buyer and a willing seller come to terms. This means that the buyer can afford the home.. As real incomes of real working people stagnate or drop, the resulting average of what a willing buyer can afford also drops… What we are looking for is equilibrium. This is done with an open auction on houses. If there aren’t buyers able and or willing at the higher price, the price keeps coming down until there is one.Tell me HOW does the government step in and get this right? This is a process of supply and demand. All the government can do is get in the way…. Which is what happened when the government came in and pushed for higher home ownership and then looked the other way when banks used predatory lending, securitized the loans, allowed the rating agencies to lie, allowed the insurance companies to insure them with no set asides for losses and allowed all this toxic waste they allowed to be created to be sold on to your pension fund.NOW HOW does this get right outside of the normal process of default, foreclosure and resale at lower prices?

GuestApril 24th, 2009 at 10:34 am

Johnny531, a participating iTuliper, posted this yesterday (itulip.com)Zero Hedge points out that, for the month of April, Goldman Sachs accounted for over 50% of NYSE member principal transactions.If I’m reading this right, they accounted for about 25% of all shares traded this last week.I’m thinking that, with their direct line to the treasury, this rally will only crash when they let it.http://zerohedge.blogspot.com/2009/0…ctions_23.htmlhttp://www.itulip.com/forums/showthread.php?t=9573

PeteCAApril 24th, 2009 at 10:44 am

No … I think the author of this article has got it wrong.Looking beyond politics, what China needs most is a large group of wealthy consumers.China needs a new market for its products.Besides the USA (which is floundering), the only other choice is Europe.If you look at the tade between price and volume – its Euro consumers whooffer the best short-term hope for China.Therefore, I’d say that the role of Euro consumers is absolutely vital to China.And so is the immediate economic direction of the Eurozone.I’d guess that there are Chinese economists who are watching the trends there daily.PeteCA

blind birdApril 24th, 2009 at 10:46 am

pjb,if any one articulates anything it is you. ok ..and others…..as a matter of course i would agree with yourconclusions as i know and therefore trust the source(author). even when i cannot follow due topersonal limitations etc..we need them and they need us but many peoplein both camps forget this or don’t know it andthen people start slaughtering one anotheror themselves.the “individual” is essential to my understandingalso, i think that’s obvious but that “individual”needs to be integrated with humanity, the ecology,the earth and beyond. if not we get the frankensteinmonsters of all the varieties, making big and longlasting messes both physical and psychic.ps. i have a habit of divergence which includesarguing, even with the author, even wheni fear i’m dead wrong. somebody has to do it ..but nature produces variety and spectrum of qualitya priori. no? we would be fools not to recognize thisand employ these resources judiciously. then again,we are fools! call the aliens!peas.and this reminds me of…..As a young man in 1728, Franklin had composed his own mock epitaph which read:The Body ofB. FranklinPrinter;Like the Cover of an old Book,Its Contents torn out,And stript of its Lettering and Gilding,Lies here, Food for Worms.But the Work shall not be wholly lost:For it will, as he believ’d, appear once more,In a new & more perfect Edition,Corrected and AmendedBy the Author.He was born on January 6, 1706.Died 17…..His gravestone would simply read:BENJAMINAndDEBORAH FRANKLIN1790America mourned. France mourned. ” Would it not become us, gentlemen, to join in this religious act, to bear a part in this homage, rendered, in the face of the world, both to the rights of man and to the philosopher who has most contributed to extend their sway over the whole earth? Antiquity would have raised altars to this mighty genius, who, to the advantage of mankind, compassing in his mind the heavens and the earth, was able to restrain alike thunderbolts and tyrants. Europe, enlightened and free, owes at lest a token of remembrance and regret to one of the greatest men who have ever been engaged in the service of philosophy and liberty. I propose that it be decreed that the National Assembly, during three days shall wear mourning for Benjamin Franklin.Today thousands of tourists annually still come to pay their respect to Benjamin Franklin. His grave is visible through an iron gate at the southeast corner of 5th and Arch Streets. Pennies dot his tombstone, as a local tradition claims that such a practice will bring the penny-tosser luck.One must wonder what the author of Poor Richard’s Almanack might think of such a practice though. On the one hand, a man famous for the line, “A penny saved, is a penny earned,” would not like throwing money away; on the other hand surely Franklin would recognize, it is only “common cents” that we would look to him for inspiration.

GuestApril 24th, 2009 at 12:24 pm

Cars have actually increased in price, the financing is lower. I go to Supercuts, increased. Food, increased all around. Macys clothing increased or no change. Repairs of all kind, increased. I don’t see where prices are dropping.We have a culture where people parrot what they hear or read. I think that’s what is operating here. Even Walmart is more expensive. Where do these people live?

HubbsApril 24th, 2009 at 1:09 pm

“Stress Test?” This has become the test of the absurd!How can we (the banks and Fed) massage the numbers? Let us count the ways.

GuestApril 24th, 2009 at 1:31 pm

Philadelphia. I can tell you for sure clothes have gotten cheaper–I just went shopping. The overpriced salon where I get my hair styled gave out $20 gift cards for their services. I was looking at cars for a few months, but stopped because it’s so annoying. Auto prices are definitely falling, whether it’s via the price paid or incentives. I have a friend who lives outside of LA. An upscale wine bar/restaurant near him has $20 dinner specials during the week (previously unheard of for this restaurant) and still can’t fill tables. Granted, not everything has gone down. Health care is not cheaper and real estate taxes are still rising.

GuestApril 24th, 2009 at 2:53 pm

Welcome to America, the World’s Scariest Emerging MarketBy Desmond LachmanSunday, March 29, 2009; B01Back in the spring of 1998, when Boris Yeltsin was still at Russia’s helm, I led a group of global investors to Moscow to find out firsthand where the Russian economy was headed. My long career with the International Monetary Fund and on Wall Street had taken me to “emerging markets” throughout Asia, Eastern Europe and Latin America, and I thought I’d seen it all. Yet I still recall the shock I felt at a meeting in Russia’s dingy Ministry of Finance, where I finally realized how a handful of young oligarchs were bringing Russia’s economy to ruin in the pursuit of their own selfish interests, despite the supposed brilliance of Anatoly Chubais, Russia’s economic czar at the time.At the time, I could not imagine that anything remotely similar could happen in the United States. Indeed, I shared the American conceit that most emerging-market nations had poorly developed institutions and would do well to emulate Washington and Wall Street. These days, though, I’m hardly so confident. Many economists and analysts are worrying that the United States might go the way of Japan, which suffered a “lost decade” after its own real estate market fell apart in the early 1990s. But I’m more concerned that the United States is coming to resemble Argentina, Russia and other so-called emerging markets, both in what led us to the crisis, and in how we’re trying to fix it.Over the past year, I’ve been getting Russia flashbacks as I witness the AIG debacle as well as the collapse of Bear Sterns and a host of other financial institutions. Much like the oligarchs did in Russia, a small group of traders and executives at onetime venerable institutions have brought the U.S. and global financial systems to their knees with their reckless risk-taking — with other people’s money — for their personal gain.Negotiating with Argentina’s top officials during their multiple financial crises in the 1990s was always an ordeal, and sparring with Domingo Cavallo, the country’s Harvard-trained finance minister at the time, was particularly trying. One always had the sense that, despite their supreme arrogance, the country’s leaders never had a coherent economic strategy and that major decisions were always made on the run. I never thought that was how policy was made in the United States — until, that is, I saw how totally at sea Treasury Secretaries Henry Paulson and Timothy F. Geithner and Federal Reserve Chairman Ben S. Bernanke have appeared so many times during our country’s ongoing economic and financial storm.The parallels between U.S. policymaking and what we see in emerging markets are clearest in how we’ve mishandled the banking crisis. We delude ourselves that our banks face liquidity problems, rather than deeper solvency problems, and we try to fix it all on the cheap just like any run-of-the-mill emerging market economy would try to do. And after years of lecturing Asian and Latin American leaders about the importance of consistency and transparency in sorting out financial crises, we fail on both counts: In March 2008, one investment bank, Bear Stearns, is bailed out because it is thought to be too interconnected with the rest of the banking system to fail. However, six months later, another investment bank, Lehman Brothers — for all intents and purposes indistinguishable from Bear Stearns in its financial market inter-connectedness — is allowed to fail, with catastrophic effects on global financial markets.In visits to Asian capitals during the region’s financial crisis in the late 1990s, I often heard Asian reformers such as Singapore’s Lee Kuan Yew or Japan’s Eisuke Sakakibara complain about how the incestuous relationship between governments and large Asian corporate conglomerates stymied real economic change. How fortunate, I thought then, that the United States was not similarly plagued by crony capitalism! However, watching Goldman Sachs’s seeming lock on high-level U.S. Treasury jobs as well as the way that Republicans and Democrats alike tiptoed around reforming Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae — among the largest campaign contributors to Congress — made me wonder if the differences between the United States and the Asian economies were only a matter of degree.On Wall Street there is an old joke that the longest river in the emerging-market economies is “de Nile.” Yet how often do U.S. leaders respond to growing signs of economic dysfunctionality by spouting nationalistic rhetoric that echoes the speeches of Latin American demagogues like Peru’s Alan Garcia in the 1980s and Argentina’s Carlos Menem in the 1990s? (Even Garcia, currently in his second go-around as Peru’s president, seems to have grown up somewhat.) But instead of facing our problems we extol the resilience of the U.S. economy, praise the most productive workers in the world, and go on and on about America’s inherent ability to extricate itself from any crisis. And we ignore our proclivity as a nation to spend, year in year out, more than we produce, to put off dealing with long-term problems, and to engage in grandiose long-term programs that as a nation we can ill afford.A singular characteristic of an emerging market heading for deep trouble is a seemingly suicidal tendency to become overly indebted to foreign creditors. That tendency underlay the spectacular collapse of the Thai, Indonesian and Korean currencies in 1997. It also led Russia to default on its debt in 1998 and plunged Argentina into its economic depression in 2001. Yet we too seem to have little difficulty becoming increasingly indebted to the tune of a few hundred billion dollars a year. To make matters worse, we do so to countries like China, Russia and an assortment of Middle Eastern oil producers — none of which is particularly well disposed to us.Like Argentina in its worst moments, we never seem to question whether it is reasonable to expect foreigners to keep financing our extravagance, and we forget the bad things that happen to the Argentinas or Hungarys of the world when foreigners stop financing their excesses. So instead of laying out a realistic plan for increasing our national savings, we choose not to face up to the Social Security and Medicare crises that lie ahead, embarking instead on massive spending programs that — whatever their long-run merits might be — we simply cannot afford.After experiencing a few emerging-market crises, I get the sense of watching the same movie over and over. All too often, a tragic part of that movie is the failure of the countries’ policymakers to hear the loud cries of canaries in the coal mine. Before running up further outsized budget deficits, should we not heed the markets that now see a 10 percent probability that the U.S. government will default on its sovereign debt in the next five years? And should we not be paying close attention to the Chinese central bank governor’s musings that he does not feel comfortable with the $1 trillion of U.S. government debt that the Chinese central bank already owns, let alone adding to those holdings?In the twilight of my career, when I am hopefully wiser than before, I have come to regret how the IMF and the U.S. Treasury all too often lectured leaders in emerging markets on how to “get their house in order” — without the slightest thought that the United States might fare no better when facing a major economic crisis. Now, I fear time is running out for our own policymakers to mend their ways and offer real leadership to extricate the United States from its worst economic calamity since the 1930s. If we insist on improvising and not facing our real problems, we might soon lose our status as a country to be emulated and join the ranks of those nations we have patronized for so long.Desmond Lachman, a fellow at the American Enterprise Institute, was previously chief emerging market strategist at Salomon Smith Barney and deputy director of the International Monetary Fund’s Policy and Review Department.http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/03/25/AR2009032502226_pf.html

MorbidApril 24th, 2009 at 3:29 pm

Is the Black Swan Really a BLACK PIG?Severe Respiratory Illness in MexicoLet’s hope this new strain is not too deadly – it seems to spread without having any contact with pigs.

A pandemic virus basically means a virus that is going to affect a large proportion of the population. It doesn’t mean they’re going to get necessarily all that sick.

This incident shows how thin the tread is by which our world hangs together. It could all come crashing down overnight.Further,

A severe respiratory illness appears to have infected 137 people in south and central areas of Mexico…

137 is the Fine Structure Constant – something that came up in a post I made recently about the new book that was out titled Deciphering The Cosmic Number – regarding the collorbation between Wolfgang Pauli (Nobel Prize 1953) and Carl Jung. This constant, 137, is psychologically connected to death, to the place where the ancestors go in the Beyond.Ho hum

MorbidApril 24th, 2009 at 3:47 pm

From Deciphering The Cosmic Number

On Friday, December 5, 1958, as he was teaching his afternoon class, Pauli suddenly began to suffer excruciating stomach pains. Up until then he had been fine. The next day he was rushed to the Red Cross Hospital in Zurich. Charles Enz visited him the day after. Pauli was visibly agitated. Had Enz noticed the number of the room, he asked him?”No,” replied Enz.”It’s 137!” Pauli groaned. “I’m never getting out of here alive.”When the doctors operated, they found a massive pancreatic carcinoma. Pauli died in Room 137 on December 15. His last request had been to speak to Carl Jung.

PeteCAApril 24th, 2009 at 4:18 pm

From Earlier … “Pete,Always good posts. My question to you is this: when the Ponzi Federal Reserve Note collapses (when Americans lose faith in Bernanke’s Fed)what will America’s money become? Roosevelt outlawed the ownership of gold for US citizens–the ban lasted ’til 1972–I’m sure Obama willdo that if Bernanke’s Fed can’t reblow up Barney Frank’s bubble. How about rare coins? Guns? Ammunition? Cocaine? Heroin?”—–I appreciate the comment and the humor.At least, I hope some of the suggestions were humor. :-) Let’s look at a few options.First, there’s too much paranoia about the Gov’t taking back gold right now. Ben Bernanke is fighting debts worth trillions of dollars. He definitely does not need to go back onto the gold standard. I’d venture to guess that that particular option is at the bottom of his list right now. If and when things ever get to the point that the Gov’t seriously thinks about re-accumulating gold, our economy is going to be fairly shot to pieces. We’re not there yet. If the Gov’t does want to take back gold, please remember that they have to PAY for it. They cannot just seize peoples’ belongings, unless they want to get a reputation to be the “new Nazi’s”. No matter how bad things are. I doubt the President would consider that. And if he ever did, the country would already be in a revolution or a civil war anyway. So realistically, the only big deal about the Gov’t buying back gold is what PRICE are they willing to pay. That issue actually would be a very big deal, because a lot of precious metals folks tend to believe that the gold price is manipulated. So gold owners are unlikely to sell back their holdings until they have good reassurance that the Gov’t has a complete “hands off” position with gold prices. This can be verified – if the big banks remove all their futures positions on gold, that would be a credible step to giving people assurance that gold is trading freely. At that point, if people want to sell their holdings – that’s their decision. I doubt that any Gov’t order to compel people to sell gold at a specified price would have any chance of success. Likewise, although rumors float around about the Gov’t seizing the assets of a gold ETF, but this is still stealing peoples’ property. It would still run the risk of starting a major breakdown in social order. Therefore, in the short term I don’t personally think we’re at “panic stations” as far as unusual Gov’t moves on gold are concerned. The practical limitation on gold is its price – a 1-oz coin is currently around $900-$1,000. You could get mugged if you carried a few of these things around – or even just one. For that reason, silver coins are actually more practical as an alternative currency. That’s why silver is called the “poor man’s gold”. Still, at this stage not many stores in the USA would know how to deal with you … if you gave them a silver coin (that might change fast if our currency starts devaluing in a major way!).More practical approaches are for you to hold some hard assets – or to barter services. Think about some practical stuff that tends to hold its value, and is useful to people on a daily basis. It could be tools, heating oil, appliances, or car parts. Or it could be stuff that people tend to want and consume … booze, cigarettes, or even some kinds of medicines. As things get tighter in our society, you could very well see people dealing in these kinds of items. Give it some thought and see if you can think of stuff that people in your area tend to really need on a daily (or weekly) basis.You can also barter services, and it’s very likely more people will be doing this. Practical skills like fixing TV’s, appliances, and cars are going to be in a lot more demand. As our standard of living goes down, people are not going to be going out and buying new stuff. So they’ve got to keep their old stuff working.Here’s a great idea that you should consider. It looks like Ford, GM and Chrysler are on the ropes. Well guess what – there are a lot of old American cars out there on the roads. And people will need to keep them running. So who’s going to fix them, and who’s going to make spare parts? There are some pretty darn good opportunities as Detroit goes out of business.As for guns … yeah a lot of people are scared. To some extent, I’ve got no beef if families want to stay safe. But a gun isn’t going to put food on your table every day. At least, not for most people (although the deer herds in this country should maybe consider taking an extended holiday overseas). You can stop people robbing you – if you own a gun … which is good. But are Americans going to take their guns and start hijacking other people’s food and water? I sure hope not – at least not in large numbers. This isn’t exactly a “Mad Max” movie. So some sensible alternatives are to either buy a home where you’ve got some land (so you can grow vege’s and have a few chickens), or to start keeping your pantry filled with some practical items that can stretch the food budget. Just simple stuff like plenty of water, boxes of pasta, rice, beans etc. Food costs are bound to increase seriously in the next decade – so this stuff will never be wasted. One thing to be careful with about guns … it’s really a weakness of guys. Guys have this tendency when things really “cave in” to take a gun and blow their brains out. It’s really not a good option. But let’s be realistic – there’s a lot of men who are under tremendous financial pressure right now. So if you keep a gun in your house, you might want to think seriously about putting some kind of reminder with it that’s helps you to “get back to earth”. Like maybe sitting a Bible beside it, or a photo of your family, or a picture of something you really like to do. Anything to remind yourself that there are always other alternatives out there. It’s also worth remembering that any time your are down at the shooting range, never fire your gun when you are angry, depressed, or just generally pissed off about life. If you do that – you are training yourself to fire a weapon during times of high emotions. Not good. Only fire the gun when you are calm and rational – hopefully that also teaches you to think before you pull the trigger in a situation with real danger. That might just save your life, or the life of a family member.America is bound to go through a period of bad inflation. It’s coming some time in our future. It could simply be double-digit inflation, or it could be genuine hyperinflation. I hope not the latter, because that would be financial hell. It’s not impossible, though. But even if we get into “stagflation on steriods” in our economy, double-digit inflation is a pretty bad experience. It means that the prices of everything will be going up just about every time you go to the grocery store. It throws families into poverty. I don’t think we’re going to avoid this in our future, and it could go on for years. So that’s why it will be good to barter useful things that people need, and to trade services.Just the same though. No matter what happens, each day when we go out the front door of our house – America is still going to be there. Our country has been through every kind of imgainable hard time before. If our parents, grandparents and distant relatives made it – then we sure should be able to cope somehow. We may have to change some of our attitudes … but that might not be the worst thing in the world anyway.PeteCA

Guest339April 24th, 2009 at 5:24 pm

Some people recommend individual gold miners stocks or the gold miners ETF (GDX) over the gold ETF (GLD) because of concerns Pete addresses, and also because gold miner stocks have reportedly outperformed gold during times such as the 1930′s.

devils advocateApril 24th, 2009 at 5:30 pm

if stocks go up,for example:retirees will start buying homes to retire to while the homes are at only 30% or less of their peak prices in states like Florida, Arizona, etc….and before inflation hits everything like a sudden tsunamipeople move in herds, and will suddenly swerve in a split second to buying-higher prices-more buying spiral upward all over again – within an amazingly very fast time frameand the stock market will skyrocket once this re-migration begins

GuestApril 24th, 2009 at 5:32 pm

No offense, but you might be on a higher rung of the socio-economic ladder than most of us. ( i.e. I go to a barber-shop not a salon.)So indeed you might be experiencing higher prices in that economic realm.

GuestApril 24th, 2009 at 5:48 pm

Okay. Let’s assume that Paulson did make the threat. So what? What value does that have now, at this juncture. If Lewis had had any balz, he would have called Pauslon’s bluff in real time (back then), and at the moment the truth would have come out and we’d all be better off for it now.But because all of these executives in govt, finance, banking/brokerage, quasi-govt. entities are cowards of the first order, they are still telling lies to themselves and (apparently) still succeeding at pulling the wool over the eyes of the public.

Grateful readerApril 24th, 2009 at 6:00 pm

My thanks too, Pete. Guess I’ll take this opportunity to say: When I don’t have much time to read much of the blog postings here, I search for your posts and only read them.

MarkApril 24th, 2009 at 6:36 pm

Mancur Olson, the political economist, in his books (The Logic of Collective Action and The Rise and Decline of Nations), speculated that small distributional coalitions tend to form over time in developed nations and influence policies in their favour through intensive, well-funded lobbying. The policies result in benefits for the coalitions and its members but large costs borne by the rest of population. Over time, the incentive structure means that more distributional coalitions accumulate burdening and ultimately paralysing the economic system causing inevitable and irretrievable economic decline.Government attempts to deal with the problems of the financial system, especially in the US, Great Britain and other countries, illustrates Olson’s thesis. Active well funded lobbying efforts and “regulatory capture” is impeding necessary actions to make needed changes in the financial system. Urgent steps are necessary to accurately recognise losses on assets, remove toxic assets from balance sheets, recapitalise the banks and allow normal financial transactions to resume. If such actions are not taken then the broader economy and sustainable growth levels will be adversely affected.Ugh, he then wipes out his own credibility when uttering: “sustainable growth!”Mark

PeterJBApril 24th, 2009 at 6:41 pm

@ PeteCA”We’re not there yet. If the Gov’t does want to take back gold, please remember that they have to PAY for it.”With respect:What “America” doesn’t understand is simply that it has lost its Prime position in this World due to its now exposed lack on integrity, which, has now been, and is continuing to be, held up in an almost fully transparent manner, despite the obvious attempts to throw the rug over all these affairs, for even the most despicable creature in a lost forsaken hole in the bottomless pit in nowhere land to see and to fully comprehend. America has become a “black hole” of its former self; sadly to say, but nevertheless true. Peoples fear the USA whereas before, peoples embraced and longed for the USA and what it represented.”America” has done this to itself and its attempts to project blame onto ethnic and religious grouping throughout the “developing” World so as, in reality, to support its key “Lobby” and all their electoral donations, is to embrace the state of “denial” as the new National religion of the USA.The shifting of focus to the “Global Economic Crisis”, like “terrorism” – that game that the whole of global “leadership” is playing in panic and desperation – is really far beneath the level of that which we had expected from the USA and the “leadership” bull is being seen (sadly) as being led around by the nose as in an agricultural showing. Those holding the rope of “leadership” is any group with some money and an intensity of interests. Control freeks, in other words.In Universal physics, it is clear that in order to control, one must lose control as for one to be armed, one needs only to develop the Mind. Man was not born naked in error. The facts upon which we build our beliefs need to be anchored and the belief system of the USA floated off its anchorages many years ago and in being held captive in some weird and insane pyrates port.”Leadership” in the USA should be ashamed, as should the American people who elected and continue to support these (mostly) parasites, betrayers and treacherous feral, so here lies the foundation of my following thesis.Upon finding some element of “leadership”, again, within the American shores, all the USA need do, is to ‘show’ that it will, has, intends to, desires, a priori, return to integrity of office, integrity of Nation, principles of freedom and most importantly, a full return to its Constitution and Bill of Rights; or, IOW, its origination roots. Upon the World seeing, and there would (as any principle in physics) initially be resistance (disbelief), that the current rotten and wholly corrupted state of affairs, across the board, would be discarded, stacked and burnt out of existence, the USA would again lead the World as the bastion of freedom and the light of liberty; not to mention the largest economic engine, ever, known to man.The USA has the largest reserves of Gold in the World, and if, “if”, it wanted to establish a Gold Standard, it easily could; its just a matter of will in integrity – and “leadership”.Or, “if”, the USA wanted to and desired to rebuild its National fabric on a foundation of strength through integrity and freedom, it could so the question begs… does it want to?I think not!and… misery loves company… (read into this what you want, because ignorance is a downward force commonly known as the “dark side”, and the “dark side” pays not!Ho hum

MarkApril 24th, 2009 at 7:00 pm

And whatever you do, don’t advertise to others what you have, especially guns. My own parents, in some moments of paranoia, indicated to someone that they had a gun and wouldn’t hesitate to use it. Well, fine and dandy IF you happen to have the gun handy and can out-maneuver anyone breaking into your house: consider a break-in when you’re sound asleep, the intruder is wide awake (yes, could be one drugs and somewhat less than sharp) and likely wielding a weapon, while you are not: who is going to get the first shot? Relying on a gun to protect you in such instances isn’t a sure thing (and I’d still put the better odds on the intruder, esp if he/she has some foreknowledge of your home). And as things get messier out in the world it will be guns that people will be looking to grab.After being involved in numerous discussions about survival tactics in the troubled times ahead I have come to appreciate the argument that most people who look to commit such acts are likely scared and hungry, and the best bet is to stay calm and offer such intruders food. This advice was more for people living out in rural areas, but I think that it should be considered in other areas/instances as well.What I’ve learned over the years is that the best way to put someone off guard is to do the unexpected. Kindness can buy more time than aggression and violence.Mark

GuestApril 24th, 2009 at 7:05 pm

News Release – April 23, 2009PUBLIC WARNING ABOUT KENWORTH SOLUTIONSThe Financial Institutions Division of the Saskatchewan Financial Services Commission (SFSC) has been made aware of an Internet based advance fee loan brokering scheme that is alleged to be operating out of Regina, Saskatchewan.Kenworth Solutions is purporting to offer online credit application with the promise of providing loan proceeds upon the receipt of a signed acknowledgement and the remittance of a portion of an insurance policy premium to secure the loan amount.When consumers have inquired with Kenworth Solutions, they have been provided with various application forms along with a false licence issued by the “State of Saskatchewan” authorizing Kenworth Solutions to carry on business in North America, Europe, Asia and South Africa. This is not a legitimate licence issued by the SFSC, and appears to have been developed to convince consumers of the company’s legitimacy.Consumers should be aware that Kenworth Solutions is not licensed by SFSC and The Trust and Loan Corporations Act, 1997 does not allow for loan brokers to charge any kind of an advance fee.Any consumer who has paid an advance fee to an unlicensed loan broker may wish to contact SFSC at 306-787-6700.http://www.gov.sk.ca/news?newsId=fb54d371-766b-4152-b492-4328bf0cf1f6

irving fphelmphApril 24th, 2009 at 7:38 pm

I’m having the same problem, which is a new problem. My solution is to reduce the size of the text.

PeterJBApril 24th, 2009 at 7:58 pm

“The financial crisis means the U.S. dollar value is changing fast, and it may retreat from being the international reserve currency. If that happens, whoever holds gold will be at an advantage.”The European Central Bank recommends its member banks hold 15% of their reserves in gold, but among Asian nations the percentage is far smaller, said Albert Cheng, World Gold Council managing director for the far east.”http://jessescrossroadscafe.blogspot.com/2009/04/china-admits-to-significantly-building.htmlPersonally, China buying Gold has never been a secret if one is literate and has moved away from the TV; it has been very obvious since BRIC announced their joint interests in purchasing Gold way back then, that is just before before yet, and besides,China has been coating their copper transmission lines with Gold in order to reduce energy losses for many years, so where did all that resource come from; of course, they produced it and bought it to balance the economy; something that the USA and other G20 are not interested in, or more likely not competent of, because they believe their “bankers” priests…News? No! Old Hat, more like it.Ho hum

PeterJBApril 24th, 2009 at 8:04 pm

Yet, another golden thread:”When it comes to trading, it’s frequently a mistake to look for reasons, because they are often not known until it’s far too late. In this case, there is no doubt we are in a period of extreme credit stress. Moreover, nearly every country on the planet is attempting to debase their currency simultaneously.”http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/2009/04/gold-continues-to-act-well.htmlFor emphasis (mine): *** “Moreover, nearly every country on the planet is attempting to debase their currency simultaneously.”***Ho hum

SimpleIsBestApril 24th, 2009 at 8:21 pm

Sir, I think especially brilliant this paragraph:”America” has done this to itself and its attempts to project blame onto ethnic and religious grouping throughout the “developing” World so as, in reality, to support its key “Lobby” and all their electoral donations, is to embrace the state of “denial” as the new National religion of the USA.”Many talk about a possible return to the Gold Standard in this forum.Sir, might you take some space to explain how a return to the Gold Std in the US would be viable or even possible at this juncture, from both US-Domestic and Global perspectives. Would the USD be the only (major) fiat currency to back itself with Gold in order for the scheme to succeed in the most utilitarian definition of success?Thank you in advance for your subsequent insight.

MarkApril 24th, 2009 at 9:01 pm

I’d brought this question up a long time ago, albeit in the opposite direction- inflation. But it does beg the question: how can there be any gains when everyone does the exact same thing?Mark

PeterJBApril 24th, 2009 at 9:35 pm

I believe that my post has already answered your question. Consider:1. The facts upon which we build our beliefs need to be anchored…2. The USA has the largest reserves of Gold in the World…3. … desired to rebuild its National fabric on a foundation of strength through integrity and freedom4. … a full return to its Constitution and Bill of RightsThe current World financial system is founded in the anglo-dutch mercantile approach which grew out of the Greek (that had to be saved twice by the Egyptians) and later Venetian “desk (banco)” systems which permits, in actual effect, currencies to be manipulated by extraneous forces. But, on the establishment of the USA Constitution, the USA went alone with a gold based system where the production of currency was vested in the Congress. Later, much later, and in grave secrecy, the Federal Reserve was quietly ushered in which adopted the anglo-dutch system of central banking, fractional reserve manipulation schema through the promises of political one-stop-ATM-vending_machine-convenience-for-Party “leadership” schema – vested in the private and secret, non-accountable FedRes, owned privately by a few major international banker oriented families…So, the unique US system was destroyed albeit from within and Nixon then was convinced to drop the Gold Standard and Larry Summers convinced Clinton to repeal the Glass Steagull Act. A fait accompli and as they say, the rest is contemporary history. Summers is also responsible for the US export of pollution on developing economies; a lovely guy, I’m sure.Economic is borne out of opinion – like morality and fashion, such opine is usually fleeting and meaningless apart from the damage it brings and leaves in its wake, so a floating fiat currency ie. non-gold based, is not anchored per se, it is however perceived to be valued or tied to the integrity and balance of trade of the issuing Nation, in this case, the USA. At present, Phhhlllaaattt!The USA could re-introduce the Gold standard to the USA without any problems except for self-interests of large groups that breathe Lobby so it would take a strong leader to break with what is being directed by Wall Street and beyond and he would have to be conversant with those skills for which leaders are supposed to posses (but never do)and of course, in the USA that would immediately be many assassinations er, suicides of the murderous nature. Not an easy route.But a Gold Standard would bring stability domestically which appears to me to be vitally important and as soon as the USA had adopted a Gold Standard, most of the rest of the World would follow like puppies following a bouncing ball; no doubt. I say this, as there are many countries that have sold their gold reserves at the direction oft those morons at IMF and World Bank and BIS, like Australia for example, which “leadership” was so eager to do anything to be invited to Bush’s Crawford Ranchero, and eat the words of another moron, etc., (I digress) so they would have no choice at all and a USA that suddenly finds itself and openly starts to eradicate the vermin feeding within its own parking lots and own empty restaurant; rats, etc., is a powerful enemy and more powerful ally where anything is possible. However, that state of a Nation does not exist today, except in potential.The Constitutional Republic of the United States of American that returns to the originating roots of its own Constitution and Bill of Rights, is the nation to be most respected and feared by every petty tyrant and imperialist government throughout this World. It would be the Global Leader, as it once was.The Gold Standard brings anchored stability exactly as, analogically, integrity brings anchored strength.It is merely a matter of “leadership” and not a Gold Standard, per se.Ho hum

HayesApril 24th, 2009 at 9:37 pm

Regina, Saskatchewan (Canada) was named by Queen (Regina) Victoria – its former name was Pile O’ Bones.Many years ago we lived in Regina and as lovely a city that Regina is, at the time the former name made complete sense to me – Ironically our address at our house in FL is almost identical to where we lived in Regina (street number X040 vs X140 and the street name exactly the same) – even more ironic (notwithstanding climate), the Pile ‘O Bones moniker is more descriptive of the economic disaster that is SW-FL vs the prosperity that the province of Saskatchewan is enjoying.

HayesApril 24th, 2009 at 10:08 pm

Morbid has referenced above something called SwineFlu -friends we have a problem and I encourage you to visit the following links – it looks like we have a pandemic in the making.Swine Flu Found in Mexican OutbreakIllness Raises Alarm Among U.S. OfficialsBy Rob Stein and David BrownWashington Post Staff WritersSaturday, April 25, 2009http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/04/24/AR2009042404075.htmlMexico Races to Stop Deadly Flu Virushttp://online.wsj.com/article/SB124058255179552887.htmlConcerns of a Swine Flu Pandemic Growhttp://www.marketwire.com/press-release/Avian-Flu-Talk-979582.htmlDeadly new flu strain erupts in Mexico, U.S.http://in.reuters.com/article/health/idINTRE53N22820090425Swine flu could infect U.S. trade and travelhttp://in.reuters.com/article/health/idINTRE53N22820090425Mexico swine flu deaths spur global epidemic fearsBy MARK STEVENSON Associated Press Writer © 2009 The Associated Presshttp://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/ap/top/world/6391440.html

jugglingcdsApril 24th, 2009 at 10:11 pm

follow up on the “swine” flu..stock market crash is nothing compared to a pandemic… scaryhttp://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=aBfUaG5IHbVU&refer=homeDeadly Swine Flu Strikes Mexico, California, Texas (Update2)Share | Email | Print | A A ABy Tom Randall and Andres R. MartinezApril 24 (Bloomberg) — Swine flu struck hundreds people in Mexico City, California and Texas, raising the threat of pandemic.At least 68 died and more than 1,000 became sick with flu- like symptoms in the Mexico City region in the past month, Jose Cordova, Mexico’s Health Minister, told reporters today. The cause was confirmed as swine flu in 20 of the deaths so far, Cordova said. Of 14 samples tested from Mexico, half matched the swine flu reported in eight people in California and Texas, the U.S. Centers of Disease Control and Prevention said today.U.S. hospitals are being asked to collect samples from patients with flu-like symptoms, said William Schaffner, an influenza expert at Vanderbilt University School of Medicine in Nashville, Tennessee. Teams of disease sleuths have been sent to California and Texas to trace how the malady has spread, and the U.S. offered to send scientists to Mexico, the CDC said. President Barack Obama is being briefed, the White House press secretary, Robert Gibbs, told reporters today.“Our concern has grown since yesterday in light of what we’ve learned since then,” said Richard Besser, acting director of the CDC, said during a conference call today with reporters. “This is something we’re worried about and taking very seriously. We are moving quickly, being very aggressive in our approach.

GuestApril 24th, 2009 at 10:11 pm

http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2009-04/25/content_7715919.htmHu [Xiaolian, State Administration of Foreign Exchange] said also revealed [on Friday] that China had boosted its gold reserves by 76 percent since 2003, making it the fifth largest holder of gold.Beijing now has 1,054 tons of gold in its reserves, 454 tons more than it did in 2003…….Commenting on China’s foreign exchange reserve portfolio, David Jiang, Asia-Pacific CEO of BNY Mellon Asset Management, said China should diversify its investment and move from US treasury bonds to inflation-proof notes and other assets.”The economic recession may cause the depreciation of many currencies, especially the US dollar, and trigger a new round of inflation once the economy starts to recover”.Fan Haibo, analyst of China Cinda Securities, said the central bank could increase its gold reserve considering the depreciation risk of some foreign currencies.”It is necessary to boost the proportion of gold holdings because China has only 2.28 percent of the global reserves and the United States has 31 percent.

AnonymousApril 24th, 2009 at 10:20 pm

Location of the outbreakhttp://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UTF8&hl=en&t=p&msa=0&msid=106484775090296685271.0004681a37b713f6b5950&ll=32.639375,-110.390625&spn=15.738151,25.488281&z=5

HayesApril 24th, 2009 at 10:24 pm

more linksCDC: Human Swine Influenza Investigationhttp://www.cdc.gov/flu/swine/investigation.htmReuters: RPT-CDC says too late to contain U.S. flu outbreakhttp://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/N24443479.htmCDC Media AdvisoryCDC Briefing on Public Health Investigation of Human Cases of Swine InfluenzaSaturday, April 25, 20091 p.m. EThttp://www.cdc.gov/media/

PeteCAApril 24th, 2009 at 10:26 pm

Mark – your suggestion on kindness is a very good one. Our family does support the needy in our community. There is a concern that as many Americans purchase guns, some may not have proper training or a good plan for home defense. A weapon requires professional training, and the overall protection plan is important. I’ve never had any conflicts with anyone … and hope I never do. Best wishes to you.PeteCA

HayesApril 24th, 2009 at 10:28 pm

and a similar maphttp://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UTF8&hl=en&t=p&msa=0&msid=106484775090296685271.0004681a37b713f6b5950&ll=32.650649,-116.139221&spn=2.062781,3.99353&z=8

HayesApril 24th, 2009 at 10:31 pm

and one of my favorite links (namesake of Morbid) the MMWRhttp://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm58d0421a1.htm

HayesApril 24th, 2009 at 10:40 pm

signing off:last linkSwine Flu Behavior “Potentially Scarier Than the Outbreak of Avian Flu”http://blogs.sciencemag.org/scienceinsider/2009/04/swine-flu-behav.html

ChignosApril 24th, 2009 at 10:54 pm

Jason you’re right, and thanks Pete for your thoughts, this was another “sterling” post. I had hoped to get the best out of PeteCAwho is obviously a little older and calm. We should all just resolve to take the country out of these economic doldrums. The peoplewho currently determine economic policy do not know what to do–that is why they are not doing anything. We do need to go backto the gold/silver standard so that the Fed can’t continue to saddle us with these horrific bursting bubbles. The Fed does not have theexpertise to be entrusted with he power to control the medium of exchange of the world.Far better it would be to limit the expansion of money supply to the amount of available gold/silver God has allowed us to mine.This was the intent of our founding fathers, who realized all too well that a central bank’s control of the currencywould ALWAYS lead to formation and bursting of fianacial bubbles, if not downright corruption.Honestly, my President is Ron Paul. I don’t respect the media-created Obama, never thought much of McCain, couldn’t care less about Congress.If those of you who read and are active on the internet are going to try to change things, my advice is follow the money. The Federal Reserve needs to beaudited, ala Rep. Paul’s bill currently before Congress. If transparency of the Fed’s meetings and balance sheet/books can beachieved, every intelligent right-thinking individual will insist that it be abolished.Rothschild said that if you control the nation’s money, you control the nation. Disraeli said “Power corrupts, and absolute power TENDSto corrupt absolutely” (capitals added for emphasis). Solzhenitzyn said: An atheist is the worst of all tyrants, but a leader who reveres the Almightyfears if his government becomes corrupt. So, don’t forget the word “TENDS” in the Disraeli quote. In America, we individuals have the opportunityto blog the policymakers to submit to the best ideas–what a gift! PeteCA is a wealth of wisdom to that end. We should pray to God for such wisdom.

ChignosApril 25th, 2009 at 12:03 am

Do you take your brain out and dribble it down the sidewalk before you write your posts, PeterJB?Seriously, try to organize your thoughts a little better before you set your fingers to the keyboard.Half us numbskulls who read your posts have no way of deciphering what the hell you mean.

ChignosApril 25th, 2009 at 12:06 am

The whole swine flu thing is hype. Get over it. This nitwittery will be forgotten in the next news cycle.

ChignosApril 25th, 2009 at 12:15 am

My God! 68 people died in Mexico city last month?????? Call out the Mexican National Guard! Quarantinethe drug cartels! Quit smoking Mexican meth! We got a real pandemic on our hands!!!!

ChignosApril 25th, 2009 at 12:28 am

Semi-clever, Mark. How about if I define wealth any way I want to and offer you this wooden nickel for your Mini Cooper?You skipped answering my request for your opinion in preference to my defining wealth for you, so……..try this:Wealth is being able to shoot your age in 18 holes of golf!!!!!

s2007April 25th, 2009 at 2:12 am

some vials were reported missing a week or so ago from fort hood or wherever these people keep this junk.my guess is that this “strain” is so “exotic” and unprecedented in the “annals of virology” what is bird swine whatever human to human, etc etc something quite unordinary – albeit that I am NOT A VIROLOGIST – google – science daily – may provide some interesting findings.We are heavily militarily involved in Mexico – which is close to collaspe (like Pakistan)- canterall – Plan Mexico – I would not put anything past these sociopaths

s2007April 25th, 2009 at 3:06 am

the theatre and controls – I bet they are just itching for a test run. One way or another please note THE ENTIRE POPULACE HAS BEN COWED INTO GAS MASKS AND BELIEF THAT THE (unelected) GOV TO SAVE THEM. What a $%^&* joke …………

PeterJBApril 25th, 2009 at 3:25 am

“Do you take your brain out and dribble it down the sidewalk before you write your posts, PeterJB?Seriously, try to organize your thoughts a little better before you set your fingers to the keyboard.Half us numbskulls who read your posts have no way of deciphering what the hell you mean.”@ Chignos on 2009-04-25 00:03:45Apologies and ughammns, but, of course, why not try it?Then: try this. If at first you don’t succeed, give up and watch some TV.The basic reason behind the USA and the rest of the World returning to Gold and/or Precious metals based currency systems is that there is no integrity remaining in any (read: any) political / National / export balance of accounts of any country left anywhere in the World today, especially the USA.The only other reason to remain on a virtual aether based fiat currency (paper) (read: toilet) system is for political convenience of currency value manipulation, du jour – which always leads to market distortion and failure (read: your history).Ho hum

PeterJBApril 25th, 2009 at 4:26 am

“In other word, the administration’s top economist still does not have a handle on the scale of the banking crisis almost two years after the crisis began in July 2007. US banks have written down $758 billion in credit losses since the crisis began and have warned of more losses to come, though no one in or out of government can say how much more.”http://henryckliu.com/page186.htmlTry this grasshopperHo hum

AnonymousApril 25th, 2009 at 6:03 am

Welcome to the brave new world: The USA inaugurates a new economic concept, the first immerging country (closely followed by the UK, but alas the UK lack natural ressources to export, whereas if things go on this way the US is set to become a major exporter of petroleum and soft commodities)

jugglingcdsApril 25th, 2009 at 7:49 am

yes chignosthere is nothing to worry about…http://www.cnn.com/2009/HEALTH/04/25/swine.flu.family/index.htmlTexas family quarantined after son contracts swine fluexcerpt:-The whole family is quarantined indefinitely, according to CNN-affiliate KABB. Henshaw said his family was shocked when they got the news about their son.(CNN) — As Hayden Henshaw was being rushed to the doctor’s office after becoming ill, his father heard that his son’s classmates had been struck with the deadly swine flu virus like the one sweeping through Mexico.Swine flu commonly affects pigs and occasionally infects people in contact with pigs.Swine flu commonly affects pigs and occasionally infects people in contact with pigs.Patrick Henshaw called his wife immediately to have Hayden checked for it. Later, they received the bad news.Hayden had become the third confirmed case of swine flu at his Texas high school. It is a virus that has killed 68 people in Mexico and infected at least eight people in the United States.Health officials arrived at the Henshaws’ house Friday and drew blood from the whole family, then told them to stay inside and away from the public, Henshaw told CNN.The whole family is quarantined indefinitely, according to CNN-affiliate KABB. Henshaw said his family was shocked when they got the news about their son.

devils advocateApril 25th, 2009 at 8:30 am

I believe the official revelation of China’s gold purchase was made at this timeto show the Chinese people that the Government has been investing into not onlyUS dollar assets but into gold which the Chinese revere…in short, to build confidence in the Government and in the ability of theGovernment to lead them out of this sudden traumatic loss of export trade

MorbidApril 25th, 2009 at 8:48 am

s2007,Exactly how many people on the planet have the symbolic knowledge about the deeper meaning of 137?And how many of those people are a part of this forum?And what are the odds that I should have inquired of PeterJB if he was interested in reading this new book about this number without prior knowledge of this “days later” news event?This is not about the rational connection of dots – this is about the irrational workings of Nature – something our one-sided rational world has lost track of.

PeterJBApril 25th, 2009 at 8:53 am

The plot thickens as its becomes momentarily clearly before it fades into the convenience of obscurity; members only:”Although the average person has never heard of it, MERS — short for Mortgage Electronic Registration Systems — holds 60 million mortgages on American homes, through a legal maneuver that has saved banks more than $1 billion over the last decade but made life maddeningly difficult for some troubled homeowners.”http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/24/business/24mers.html?_r=3&pagewanted=1&ref=todayspaperIndeed, an innovative tactic to conceal.Ho hum

GuestApril 25th, 2009 at 9:12 am

Can anyone supply data for consumer credit lines vs. corporate lines? I’ve heard $4.2tn for consumer but then have heard the same figure for overall. An observation: I think MSFT’s guidance for reduced costs by mid 2010 is exemplary of how the economy will devolve: less travel, less employees, less credit, less demand all around > leading to factor of production re-rationalization that has to last into 2011. Simple story but kind of puts a time frame into my head as to the tertiary effects of current corporate and consumer actions.Lastly, I had a thought that someone here might be able to debunk: We’ve all been taught that given a certain level of M2 and a propensity to spend, you come up with a production number, GDP. It’s of course old news that velocity has fallen off a cliff. But it seems to me that when you have a ‘textbook’ shift in savings from 20% to 22%, you have a much much more muted output re-alignment than if you move from 4% to 6% (if you consider that 1/1-mpc has something to do with the multiplier and with velocity). So it seems that a very small increase in savings could have a very large impact on velocity given our current high level of spending. Am I off base? Seems to me that this will draw on GDP until we can ‘restock’ our lifestyles/debt levels and reload our risk tolerance (propensity to be optomistic and invest in rosey outcomes).

MorbidApril 25th, 2009 at 9:25 am

I repeat this recent post from above as it also belongs to this discussion.s2007,Exactly how many people on the planet have the symbolic knowledge about the deeper meaning of 137?And how many of those people are a part of this forum?And what are the odds that I should have inquired of PeterJB if he was interested in reading this new book about this number without prior knowledge of this “days later” news event?This is not about the rational connection of dots – this is about the irrational workings of Nature – something our one-sided rational world has lost track of.

kilgoresApril 25th, 2009 at 10:30 am

Thanks for the link, Hayes. Very interesting.Folks who immediately dismiss concerns about the potential danger as being overblown, in my experience, don’t seem to have a very good grasp of history or science. As Dr. Richman suggests, confirmed human-to-human transmission of swine flu is scary, because that’s exactly how pandemics — such as that caused by the spread of 1918 Spanish Flu — occur.As little as two years ago, a lot of folks could not conceive that we would soon be facing a global financial crisis of the proportions that now have come to pass, and criticized Dr. Roubini and others who saw clearly what was approaching as “Chicken Littles.” They’re not laughing now.Go to an old graveyard sometime and start counting the 1918 era tombstones, especially the ones for infants and young children. You’ll quickly get a picture of how bad an unpredicted pandemic can be.SWK

s2007April 25th, 2009 at 10:34 am

Morbid, I am sure there are all types of trolls, etc disseminating info on this blog – it is widely read, with that said, you have made an astute observation.anyone w/ an (ahem)… college education should know the meaning – if one can be ascribed – it is so very obviously planted in this media casecheers

GuestApril 25th, 2009 at 10:41 am

Morbid, I am sure there are all types of trolls, etc disseminating info on this blog – it is widely read, with that said, you have made an astute observation.anyone w/ an (ahem)… college education should know the meaning – if one can be ascribed – it is so very obviously planted in this media casecheers

kilgoresApril 25th, 2009 at 10:52 am

“According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), it has been estimated that in the absence of any control measures such as vaccination and drugs, a “medium-level” influenza pandemic in the United States could kill 89,000 to 207,000 people, affect from 15 to 35 percent of the U.S. population, and generate associated costs ranging from $71 billion to $167 billion. Another Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) estimate suggested that, in the United States alone, up to 200 million people will be infected, 50 million people will require outpatient care, two million people will be hospitalized, and between 100,000 and 500,000 persons will die.”http://www.globalsecurity.org/security/ops/hsc-scen-3_flu-pandemic-deaths.htmJust what do you imagine an unacceptable death rate to be? A death rate of .68% may sound insignificant, but it is huge for a single cause/event, particularly one that potentially affects millions of people worldwide. It will make a lot more people seriously ill, and will carry have cost impacts even on those not directly affected by the illness.SWK

jugglingcdsApril 25th, 2009 at 11:32 am

okay financial collapse,wars =horsemen 1pandemic flu =horsemen 2computer virus =horsemen…. what the ??? LOL

MorbidApril 25th, 2009 at 12:31 pm

Your math is wrong.It’s 6.8% death rate so far – or about twice what the Spanish Flu was in 1918.

MorbidApril 25th, 2009 at 12:46 pm

More Freedom Of Speech Violated

]“The Democrats have a lot to learn about the right of free speech under the US Constitution. Congress Henry Waxman’s (D-CA) refusal to expose Al Gore’s sci-fi comedy-horror testimony to proper, independent scrutiny by the House minority reeks of naked fear,” Monckton said from the airport Thursday evening.“Waxman knows there has been no ‘global warming’ for at least a decade. Waxman knows there has been seven and a half years’ global cooling. Waxman knows that, in the words of the UK High Court judge who condemned Gore’s mawkish movie as materially, seriously, serially inaccurate, ‘the Armageddon scenario that he depicts is not based on any scientific view,’” Monckton explained. Monckton has previously testified before the House Committee in March.

GuestApril 25th, 2009 at 1:37 pm

This is from Mishs Blog.A guy named Black swan wrote this and I found it very interesting even If most here know this anyway.Was Bank of America’s Ken Lewis may have been forced to buy Merrill Lynch, but he was also promised some very lucrative Government business, like managing distressed assets? Let’s take a little walk down Memory Lane (and Maiden Lane).In 1982, at the age of 29, Larry Fink became the youngest managing director of First Boston. What Mr. Fink did at that time was invent the CMO (collateralized mortgage obligation bond), the weapons of mass financial destruction that brought down the US economy.In 1986, Mr. Fink learned a big lesson, when his bond trading went bad and he lost First Boston $100 million.In 1988 Fink founded BlackRock.In 2005 Fink smelled something foul in the air and cut way back on owning risky mortgages. This, of course, was the year when the rest of Wall Street went in the opposite direction, and loaded up on toxic waste.In 2006 Merrill Lynch acquired a 49% interest in BlackRock.In early 2008 Mr. Fink’s BlackRock got a no-bid contract from the Fed to manage the $30 billion from collapsed Bear Stearns’ assets. Those assets under BlackRock’s management have lost over 30% of their value. BlackRock is being paid $6 million a year by the Fed for the expert management of those BS assets.In 2008 BlackRock pulled in $408 million in management fees.In September of 2008, the Lewis run Bank of America bought Merrill Lynch, and, consequently, 49% of BlackRock.BlackRock, in another no-bid contract deal, is now managing $170 billion in assets in the AIG bailout.We know that there will be at least another trillion in bad assets needing to be managed, and BlackRock should be the ringmaster of the circus.In the Federal Reserves new program to buy $500 billion in mortgage backed securities, BlackRock is one of the four firms managing the assets.With all these management deals, BlackRock will be making hundreds of millions. Now might be the time to buy some of this pirate stock, or, you could wait until BlackRock starts buying up some of that $1 trillion in toxic assets from the PPIP (Geithner Plan). It had been reported that Geithner brought in Mr. Fink to help craft the plan. After all, who would know more about toxic MBS than the guy who invented them?What can a private hedge fund this powerful do? It can have a whole lot of influence over the US Government, loot the taxpayers, and it can secretly launder foreign money that wants to buy firesaled distressed US assets. BofA’s Ken Lewis could make out like a bandit, or bankster, or am I being redundant?

PeteCAApril 25th, 2009 at 1:49 pm

regarding some earlier comments from folks about US gold reserves, and what’s going on with the dollar and currenciesFirst, please see this article for some comments about the Fed and the bullion banks. I personally don’t like to promote a “conspiracy” thought process about investing. However, what the author isfundamentally saying is correct. Gold has been loaned by the US Gov’t and sold. They ca’t get this gold back unless they are willing to pay much higher prices to re-stock the US gold reserves, or they are willing to force miners in the USA to ptrovide gold at a lower cost than they do to the public.Gold Reserves and Bullion BanksTherefore, if the global system returned to a gold standard then it’s really unclear just how much the central banks have in gold reserves. My guess is .. the USA has been selling for a long time and probably has substantially less than listed on public records. This would force the price of gold to jump by maybe a factor of 10 times, if the global system went back to this standard.Although a gold standard enforces honesty in international transactions, this is not what the central banks want. or at least – it’s not what the countries who are deeply in debt want. It would take away most of the fancy footwork that the Fed is able to perform. So as I said before, I seriously doubt that Bernanke wants to do this.Much more likely would be the following scenario. If the US dollar “refuses” to go down in the intermediate future, then the USA may choose to announce a sudden devaluation of its currency. So if the dollar was devalued by 50%, this would cause the rpice of gold to double (against the dollar). Naturally the public would not be informed ahead of time. But given the insider leaks we have seen between Washington, the Fed, and Wall St, almost certainly some traders would get wind of this. So very likely a telltale sign would be a sudden dramatic jump in the price of gold … maybe the single biggest one-day jump ever (but for no apparent reason). That would likely signal that the USA would going to make a surprise announcement about currency devaluation.I am not saying this scenario is going to happen. It’s also quite conceivable that the USA dollar could resume its long-term downwards course in the currency charts. Naturally, the folks at the ed would much prefer this to happen. They want to see a steady controlled drop in the dollar, as part of a long-term inflation policy.PeteCA

PeteCAApril 25th, 2009 at 1:56 pm

Last sentence should have said … “naturally the folks at the Fed would much prefer this to happen … “And I should also add. There have been some bite-size jumps in gold over the last week. This is not the kind of one-day jump I am referring to in my article immediately above. That would be a huge jump. The current bite-size jumps (by $5-$10 per ounce) are likely reflecting buying by some central banks (e.g. China), or major jumps in holding by hedge funds or ETF’s.PeteCA

GuestApril 25th, 2009 at 2:27 pm

A lot of the recent buying was (1) short covering and (2) buying on the technicals that were showing it was oversold.

PeterJBApril 25th, 2009 at 2:43 pm

Gold: @ PeteCAAnd, if you buy and hold gold, it never, ever turns toxic, it always retains value and has done for thousands of years, unlike the crap shilled by economists, talking heads and “experts”. Gold is value; true value and will win despite the outcome of any and all political destruction of values.Gold represents true Universal Principles across the full spectrum of all life ie, the metals, biological and the plants and gases and intrinsically as well as innately belongs to the realm of nature in a more advanced state than the evolution of man; it is man’s dream of Effect.Think of it this way: The Church of Rome sold pieces of paper in return for gold that forgave your sins and at different prices for differing sins. These pieces of paper represent the various pieces of paper today offered by the financial industry and supported by your Central Bank and your government. Eventually, for the man in the street, such pieces of paper have a high probability of evaporating or at least turning toxic.As the FedRes, which includes most mainstream institutional and academic economists and all politicians, have really no idea about the phenomena of economics, the major bets are now shifting to gold and other precious metals betting that current fiat currencies, which includes the US dollar, are done and or will be done and very soon.Of course, if you buy gold in order to protect your family’s future survival due to socio-economic instability, you are expressing your lack of faith in “leadership”, and you run the risk of being accused of being a “terrorist”, or whatever else is convenient by those of Hanlon’s Razor. Paper promises in unstable times have a high probability of becoming empty promises; it is all about risk.Bottom line: If you don’t understand a force, you can’t manipulate that force without the probability of that force becoming distorted and unstable; such as the case today.Ho hum

SoftwarengineerApril 25th, 2009 at 4:00 pm

THE MALTHIS THEORY CORRECTIONAssuming we’ve reached the Malthis moment where uncontrolled growth has totally destroyed the availablejobs, what happens? Wages decrease. But wait, we’ve flooded the gates with inflationary money; won’t thatincrease wages, prices and hence home prices too? Think about it pragmatically. If and when the inflation monsterjoins horrifying unemployment [stagflation], what happens to mortgage interest rates? They sky-rocket.What happens to home values when interest rates sky-rocket? They collapse. Its a conundrum and predictablyunpredictable.Basic facts: we’re out of fish, water, oil and hence food. Supply and demand says home prices will remain wherethe market demand can obtain them. Money magazine stated this month that the mortgage borrowing rules have changedfor getting today’s lower interest rates with a destroyed banking system:OLD NEW5% Down 20% DownNA 6 Months of Salary in Savings after down payment600 Credit 740 Credit RatingWhat first time home buyers can buy in at the new lower interest rates,even with Obama’s $8000 tax credit? No one, as I say that, because ifyou have brains to save the kind of cash to qualify, the last thingyou’ll use that kind of money is a real estate investment.Hypothesis Conclusion: Home prices going down no matter what.Solution: Try some new model, stop trying to resurrect Frankenstein.The old uncontrolled growth model caused the bubble and trying itagain will make it worse!

MorbidApril 25th, 2009 at 4:34 pm

Obama Visit

The first case was seen in Mexico on April 13. The outbreak coincided with the President Barack Obama’s trip to Mexico City on April 16. Obama was received at Mexico’s anthropology museum in Mexico City by Felipe Solis, a distinguished archeologist who died the following day from symptoms similar to flu, Reforma newspaper reported. The newspaper didn’t confirm if Solis had swine flu or not.The Mexican government is distributing breathing masks to curtail the disease’s spread.There is no vaccine against the new strain of swine flu, health authorities said.

Has Obi been infected?

MorbidApril 25th, 2009 at 4:58 pm

Tamiflu Won’t Help USAStock up on food and essentials. The entire food chain may come unglued.If this new version of Swine Flu acts like the 1918 Swine Flu this is going to be a worldwide 500 million death disaster.

Devastated communitiesStreet car conductor in Seattle not allowing passengers aboard without a mask in 1918.While in most places less than one-third of the population was infected, only a small percentage of whom died, in a number of towns in several countries entire populations were wiped out.Even in areas where mortality was low, those incapacitated by the illness were often so numerous as to bring much of everyday life to a stop. Some communities closed all stores or required customers not to enter the store but place their orders outside the store for filling. There were many reports of places with no health care workers to tend the sick because of their own ill health and no able-bodied grave diggers to bury the dead. Mass graves were dug by steam shovel and bodies buried without coffins in many places.Several Pacific island territories were particularly hard-hit. The pandemic reached them from New Zealand, which belatedly implemented measures to prevent ships carrying the flu from leaving its ports. From New Zealand, the flu reached Tonga (killing 8% of the population), Nauru (16%) and Fiji (5%, 9000 people). Worst affected was Western Samoa, a territory then under New Zealand military administration. A crippling 90% of the population was infected; 30% of adult men, 22% of adult women and 10% of children were killed. By contrast, “[t]he flu was excluded from American Samoa by a commander who imposed a blockade”. The mortality rate in New Zealand itself was 5%.

GuestApril 25th, 2009 at 5:28 pm

@PeteCaWhat to make of the IMF issuing bonds? The start of the central bank of central banks? What’s next-will they issue their own currency?http://finance.yahoo.com/news/IMF-head-says-it-will-sell-apf-15033270.html?sec=topStories&pos=main&asset=&ccode=

GuestApril 25th, 2009 at 6:49 pm

I think you missed the point darling’.BTW, plenty of gals go to my barber shop, their hair looks great and they have not lost a small fortune in the process.

GuestApril 25th, 2009 at 7:04 pm

SHAREHOLDERS BE DAMNED! By ALAN ABELSONHow the Washington gang brought Ken Lewis to heel and forced Bank of America to go through with its acquisition of loss-ridden MerrillLynch. If everything’s coming up roses, why are corporate insiders selling?April 25, 2009 — IT WAS JUST LIKE ONE OF THOSE NOIR FLICKS crafted from a Raymond Chandler novel. Imagine the opening scene.The time is last December. It’s a cold night with the wind howling. The camera zooms in on a dimly lit room in the center of which sitsa bespectacled banker sweating bullets, his body limp in a ratty chair, surrounded by a bunch of nasty-looking hombres wearingdouble-breasted suits, sinister fedoras and stone expressions.One of the gang, obviously a capo, leans menacingly toward the banker and snarls, “Do what we tell you to do or you’ve had it!” The banker knowshe’s in the tightest spot he has ever been in his 62 otherwise wonderful years on this blessed earth. (Worse by far than the time he had to collarthat killer disguised as a little old lady threatening to blow the bank up with a stick of dynamite “she” had sequestered in “her” bloomers.)If he agrees to do what they want, he risks losing his good name and with it the irreplaceable precious fruits of a lifetime of earnest labor.If he doesn’t…The toughs grow impatient. Shaking with fear, the banker rises from the chair to face his remorseless tormentors. From the hidden depths of hisbeing he somehow summons up the courage to declare in a suddenly strong and unwavering voice: “I’ll take it up with my board.”OK, so this audacious show of verbal defiance may not quite reach the level of “Give me liberty or give me death.” But we live in a lesseloquent age than did Patrick Henry and, remember, our hero is a banker, not a fiery patriot. And it takes a very brave man to tell his boardanything more substantive than what’s on the menu for lunch.Moreover, this was no celluloid chiller. It was the real thing. The banker, as you may have guessed, is Ken Lewis, CEO of Bank of America .And the bad guys harassing him are Hank Paulson, then Treasury secretary, and Ben Bernanke, head of the Federal Reserve, aided and abetted byshadowy henchmen.The script for this stranger-than-fiction melodrama was provided by that rabid (and fiercely ambitious) bulldog New York state attorney general,Andrew Cuomo. Mr. Cuomo, back in February, had been grilling Mr. Lewis on what his keen canine eye detected as another indignity — the awarding of$3.6 billion to employees of Merrill Lynch, the giant brokerage firm acquired by BofA on Jan. 1 of this year.What had Mr. Cuomo frothing at the mouth was that the $3.6 billion was shelled out even though Merrill suffered losses upwards of $15 billion in 2008′sfourth quarter alone.We must point out how fortuitous it was that losses had not reached, say, $30 billion, since by the peculiar calculus being used to reward red-ink, thatwould have boosted Merrill’s bonus tab to $7.2 billion. And enraging the chronically enraged Mr. Cuomo all the more was that the bonuses were distributedeven while the losses manifested themselves but were not disclosed, least of all to the bank’s shareholders.According to Mr. Cuomo’s dour narrative, the product of four hours of interrogation of Mr. Lewis, the merger with Merrill was proposed in Septemberafter two days of due diligence (sounds more like due negligence to us). It gained approval of shareholders of both companies on Dec. 5. Barely a weeklater comes the revelation: Merrill’s losses were spiraling ever higher, causing an increasingly frantic Mr. Lewis to weigh calling the marriage off.He reckoned he could legally do so thanks to MAC (material adverse event), recognizing that $7 billion more in losses than had been projected when themerger was agreed to was a very big MAC, indeed. He diffidently informed the powers-that-were of his plan to nix the nuptials and was summarilysummoned to powwow with them in Washington that very evening. And it was there that Messrs. Bernanke and Paulson put the screws to him to not break thedeal lest he trigger a systemic calamity.On Dec. 21, Mr. Lewis, still of a mind to ditch the merger, communicated his determination to Mr. Paulson, who bluntly warned that he would give the bootto Mr. Lewis and his board unless the acquisition went through. To that bald threat, Mr. Lewis’ retort was a resounding purr: “That makes it simple. Let’sde-escalate.”And de-escalate he did. The merger became a done deal right on schedule. To help salve any hurt feelings, Bank of America got $118 billon in loanguarantees from rich Uncle Sam to absorb any potential losses from Merrill.Let’s put it this way: As a stimulus for equities, come rain or come shine, just about nothing beats higher prices. They entice risk-shy investors,including or especially (hard to decide) those who have been mauled by the bear market, to edge off the sidelines and get their feet wet.Higher stock prices (as Ken Lewis might say) escalate expectations and earnings estimates of analysts, most of whom are, in any case, reflexivelybullish. They give the yak-yaks on Tout TV something to crow over and excite their innocent viewers.We don’t mean to beat up on Mr. Lewis. We haven’t the faintest doubt his refusal to stand tall was not prompted by fear of being fired. Heavens toBetsy, no. Rather, it likely sprang from too much heart: a deep-seated solicitude for his shareholders and a touching desire to shield them from theawful truth about the Merrill acquisition. Sure, they’re the putative owners of the company, but best not to upset them over something they’dinevitably learn about in due course when those losses started to eat up the bank’s bottom line.As to Mr. Paulson and Mr. Bernanke, we’re sure they, too, are decent souls and value truth, except when it’s inconvenient. Despite vows oftransparency and all that blah, they were more than complicit in a rather shabby cover-up; they conceived it, pursued it and made certain throughmeans fair and foul it was carried out.Why, then, should anyone worry about the results of the bank stress tests slated to be released early next month and have inspired so muchanticipatory dread on Wall Street? As one wise cynic asks, given its demonstrated devotion to the banks and the financial markets, do you reallythink that the Washington gang is going to throw anybody of significance under the bus?

PeteCAApril 25th, 2009 at 7:14 pm

Picking up a news item about the swine ‘flu outbreak.Personally I am not too concerned yet … because it looks like the authorities are responding quickly on this problem. But let’s take a look at one quick comment:”At least 62 people have died from severe pneumonia caused by a flu-like illness in Mexico, WHO says. Some of those who died are confirmed to have a unique flu type that is a combination of bird, pig and human viruses. The virus is genetically identical to one found in California.”Microbiology is hardly my strongpoint.Going back in distant memory, I think these viruses are capable of significant mutations.[someone please correct me if I'm wrong]But I have to wonder how you wind up with a virus with components that are derived from human, swine and bird origins. Here’s my point … if someone deliberately wanted to engineer a virus used for biological terrorism, the virus they are describing here sure sounds like an excellent candidate. A ‘flu virus is highly contagious, and it sounds like this one is quite unusual in its makeup. Furthermore, releasing it in a place like Mexico City would put a lot of people at risk, and possibly accomplish the goal of threatening the United States. I suspect knowledgeable people will look at this possibility. Still, like I said, biology is not hardly specialty and these speculations might miss the point entirely. Let’s hope that they get this thing contained quickly.PeteCA

IdunnoApril 25th, 2009 at 7:29 pm

SARS, Avian Flu – what short memories we have. Which Pharma concern will benefit the most the latest barrage of fear injections.

MorbidApril 25th, 2009 at 7:54 pm

New Swine Flu Likely Widespread

A new and unusual strain of swine flu is likely widespread and impossible to contain at this point, experts agree.

They do mutate over time – probably why the 1918 pandemic faded after an intense six months to a year as I recall.There are so many vectors for this to get you through – I was just wondering if I want to have our mail delivery put on hold. Crazy stuff like that.There has been a growing fear amongst scientist that we are nearing another 1918 type incident. Maybe this is it. Maybe not. If not, does the danger go away or does the virus mutate into something more deadly.Something to sleep on.I can’t imagine what will happen if this is a real 1918 style “killer” – I keep imagining what I would do if I still lived in LA.I see WHO has gone International with their concern. If bad news continues to pour out of Mexico it will be 9/11 all over again. No airplane flights, etc.I also am hearing the Mexico is under-reporting the problem – probably so as not to panic the citizens.

subgeniusApril 25th, 2009 at 8:07 pm

What, a climate change denier publicizing nonsense? I am shocked, shocked I tell you…The planet HAS NOT been “cooling” for years. It is slightly LESS warm than a recent spike, but the moving average is still indicating warming.

BrianApril 25th, 2009 at 8:13 pm

A bioengineered virus like this is HIGHLY unlikely. It is relatively easy for this type of flu to be created in nature. Furthermore, it is inevitable that this kind of mutated flu virus will arise periodically and repeatedly.There is no need to consider this outbreak to be caused by any intentional action by any human being.That said, the implications are the same, regardless of the origin.Since this is an economics blog, I will not discuss the matter beyond pointing out the economic implications. The humanist implications are a totally different matter.Fear is a killer of the economy. Rational or not, if people believe that they are in danger by being exposed to other people, they will curtail activities that bring them into proximity with other people.The news cycle on this has only just begun. If the outbreak gains any momentum, it will dominate the headlines. Consumers worldwide could shut themselves in.This, then, would constitute a “Black Swan” event that could speed the economic downturn. No houses get sold if buyers want to avoid contact with other people. Retail sales and services would be similarly devastated.Again, this consequence arises out of fear, not out of reality. If the reality becomes a pandemic, well, at that point it feels pedantic to be discussing the impact on the economy – even on this blog.–Brian

ThetaApril 25th, 2009 at 8:25 pm

Viruses versus HumansWhat we currently know about InfluenzaThe first article is a good general overview, while the second web page is more technical.Flu viruses are rotten for bioweapons because the mutate too fast and they’re not predictable. That and flu viruses are not difficult to defeat. Wash your hands properly (remembering the lather is the important bit), and don’t touch your eyes, nose or mouth unless you’re sure your hands are clean, and you’ll avoid a large majority of lurking pathogens. (I guess you’re out of luck if someone sneezes on your face…)So don’t put your mail on hold – just wash your hands after you look through it.

GuestApril 25th, 2009 at 8:33 pm

Exactly. It began long ago, in July 1944 to be exact. Here is corroborative evidence compiled from G. Edward Griffin’smassive treatise on the Fed:Harry Dexter White and John Maynard Keynes were the theoreticians who guided the 1944 Bretton Woods Monetary Conference at which theIMF/World Bank was created.White was a member of the Communist Party. Keynes was a member of the Fabian Society. They shared the same goal of international socialism.The IMF and World Bank were designed as mechanisms for eliminating gold from world finance. The Federal Reserve’s role, through a complex tangleof bank loans, subsidies and grants, was to be “lender of last resort” for virtually the entire planet.Says Griffin: “Prior to this conference, currencies were exchanged in terms of their gold value, and the arrangement was called the‘gold-exchange standard.’ This is not the same as a ‘gold-standard’ in which a currency is backed by gold. It was merely that theexchange ratios of the various currencies—most of which were not backed by gold—were determined by how much gold they could buy in the market.Politicians and bankers hated the arrangement, because it was beyond their ability to manipulate…”The method by which this was to be accomplished was exactly the method devised on Jekyll Island to allow American banks to create money out ofnothing without paying the penalty of having their currencies devalued by other banks. It was the establishment of a world central bank whichwould create a common fiat money for all nations and then require them to inflate together at the same rate. There was to be a kind of internationalinsurance fund which would rush that fiat money to any nation that temporarily needed it to face down a ‘run’ on its currency…“When the IMF was created, it was the vision of Fabian Socialist John Maynard Keynes that there be a world central bank issuing a reserve currency calledthe ‘bancor’ to free all governments from the discipline of gold. With the creation of Special Drawing Rights (SDRs), the IMF had finally begun tofulfill that dream.”

GuestApril 25th, 2009 at 8:45 pm

HEALTH PLANS LOSE MEMBERS TO LAYOFFS | The Wall Street JournalApril 23, 2009 — As the country’s biggest health insurers report their first quarter earnings, the record number of members they are losingto unemployment is another ominous sign that the ranks of uninsured Americans have soared since the recession’s onset.The latest indicator came from WellPoint Inc., the country’s largest health insurer with nearly 35 million medical-plan members, which reporteda 1.3% drop in first-quarter net income. The insurer said it shed nearly 500,000 net members since the end of December…The impact of rising unemployment on health insurers’ membership rolls reinforces what analysts and economists say is all but certain: that the numberof uninsured likely has risen by several million people since the U.S. Census Bureau in 2007 pegged it at 45.7 million…Kaiser estimates that, of the nine million people expected to have lost employer-sponsored health coverage since December 2007, about four millionof them are now uninsured. An additional 3.6 million have likely enrolled in Medicaid or other public programs… That suggests the number ofuninsured Americans is now close to 50 million.On Tuesday, UnitedHealth Group Inc., the second-largest insurer in terms of members, reported a 900,000 drop in the number of people enrolled in itscommercial health plans in the first quarter, compared with the end of last year…

MorbidApril 25th, 2009 at 8:57 pm

The Red Horse of the Apocalypse?

When he broke the second seal, I heard the second animal shout, “COME.” And out came another horse, bright red, and its rider was given this duty: to take away peace from the earth and set people killing each other. He was given a huge sword. Rev. 6:3-4

Spreading the virus is – “set people killing each other.”Theta, thanks for the hand washing tip – after reading the mail. That should do it – have to be careful about letting the mail rub on stuff – like cloths, counter tops, etc. My God, what is our world coming to. It’s becoming all too MORBID.

HayesApril 25th, 2009 at 9:11 pm

@ Morbid – check outhttp://www.flutrackers.com/forum/search.php?searchid=1176799great site for all things pandemic – Henry (recombinomics) posts regularly there

GuestApril 25th, 2009 at 9:12 pm

The Wall Street Journal April 23:CORPORATE NEWSSlump Persists for Freight HaulersFirst-Quarter Volumes at UPS, Two Big Railroads Expected to Show DeclineVW’s Net Tumbles 74% on Global SlumpImmelt Says GE Is Braced for a StormBoeing Cuts Outlook as Net SagsWeak Airline Traffic, Tight Financing Precipitate Deferred Aircraft OrdersEBay Profit Falls 22%As Shoppers Cut BackTechnology Business Bolsters NorthropThe Los Angeles defense contractor on WednesdayReported a 47% increase in 1st-Q profitEmployers Make Cuts Despite Belief Upturn Is NearSome Worry That Reductions Will Prove Costly When Recession Ends and Disgruntled Workers Can Seek New JobsGlaxo Profit Falls 13%,Hurt by Generic RivalsStrong iPhone SalesHelp Buoy AT&TMUTUAL FUNDSMoney-Market Assets FallAs Mutual Funds See InflowsAssets in money-market funds fell $28.32 billion in the latest week, even as theweeks-long stock market rally stalled, according to iMoneyNet’s Money FundReport…The Investment Company Institute said Wednesday that long-term mutual funds saw$8.86 billion of net inflows, or net purchases, for the week ended April 15… long-termmutual funds saw inflows for the fifth consecutive week as investors poured intoboth bond and stock funds, though at a slower pace than in prior weeks, according toICI. Inflows in the past five weeks have brought the total to $46.23 billion.

HayesApril 25th, 2009 at 9:18 pm

now it gets interesting:From Bloomberg (yes from Bloomberg)Mexico’s Calderon Declares Emergency Amid Swine Flu Outbreak…”Obama’s VisitThe first case was seen in Mexico on April 13. The outbreak coincided with the President Barack Obama’s trip to Mexico City on April 16. Obama was received at Mexico’s anthropology museum in Mexico City by Felipe Solis, a distinguished archeologist who died the following day from symptoms similar to flu, Reforma newspaper reported. The newspaper didn’t confirm if Solis had swine flu or not. “…http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=aEsNownABJ6Q&refer=worldwide

GuestApril 25th, 2009 at 9:31 pm

The rest of Alan Abelson’s Up and Down Wall Street column in today’s Barron’s:SINCE WE ENDED THE LAST ITEM with a question (two, to be precise), we feel, just in the interest of interconnectivity,we should begin this one with a question: How come, if the stock market is telling us everything is coming up roses –the Dow has shot up 23% since March 9, the S&P 500 28% and dear old Nasdaq 34% — corporate insiders are selling like there’s no tomorrow?Much as anything, we suspect, what has given legs to this rather improbable but undeniably impressive rally is the rally itself.Let us assure you that we haven’t gone mystical (we’ve enough sins to atone for without adding still another).In other words, they serve to inject a dose of euphoria into the investment atmosphere, particularly after a long and morose stretchof gloomy markets, like last year’s.Of course, rising equity prices also inspire less chimerical reasons for the quickened interest in the stock market. They are widely takenby institutions, individuals and kibitzers as a welcome harbinger of economic recovery, and there’s been a lot of that lately. Our own feeling,as you may have gleaned, is that such hopes are heavily laced with wishful thinking.Leading us to the question with which we began these musings: If those now infamous shoots of recovery are popping up all over, why wouldinsiders be so aggressively dumping stocks?Yet, they indisputably are. According to a study prepared for Bloomberg by Washington Service, a research outfit, directors, officers andthe like have sold $353 million worth of stock in this fading month, or 8.3 times the total bought. As a matter of fact, according to thefirm, insider purchases of $42.5 million are on track to make April the skimpiest month for such buying since July 1992.The pace of selling in the first three weeks of this month, incidentally, was the swiftest since the market peaked and the bear came outof hibernation with a vengeance in October ’07.We’re quite aware that insiders are not infallible. But they are, after all, in the front lines of commerce and industry and so presumably have abetter fix on the economy and the prospects for recovery than analysts and economists, whether of macro or micro persuasion.And just as they wouldn’t be laying off people in such extraordinary numbers if they thought their business was about to rebound soon,they’d be loath to liquidate their holdings in such an emphatic way if they espied a turnaround in the offing.It all boils down to this: Nobody ever sold a stock because they thought it would go up. And as a group, corporate insiders obviously arescarcely enthusiastic about the prospects for a genuine bull market.

kilgoresApril 25th, 2009 at 9:37 pm

The fact that a particular viral outbreak ultimately does not lead to a devastating global pandemic does not invalidate concerns about why it could have. Hopefully, this current outbreak of swine flu will stop well short of a 1918 Spanish Flu situation; but then again, it may. Big Pharma spends very little time in the development of vaccines because there is no money in it, so any “fear injections” hypothesis is probably without foundation.SWK

s2007April 25th, 2009 at 10:15 pm

ok – it may not be the evil gov – although it will ALWAYS my 1st suspect.the odd part about the H1N1 is the eurasian component, the best theory so far is the “Chinese traveler”, however, how many Chinese tourists are there in Perote, MX???From Civil Eats:http://civileats.com/2009/04/25/swine-flu-linked-to-smithfield-pig-cafo/Until now Confined Animal Feeding Operations (CAFOs) have been mostly criticized for the cess pools they produce, and the mistreatment of animals and workers. But following along as Nicholas Kristof reported in the New York Times recently, there is a risk that MRSA, a virulent bacteria without any cure, is being incubated in hog operations in the midwest — a bug that is easily transmissible to humans via our genetic similarities to pigs. Now, a much bigger problem has presented itself — it seems a new virulent flu, which the World Health Organization is saying has “pandemic potential,” has been possibly linked to a CAFO in Perote, Mexico owned and operated by industrial pork operator Smithfield.Smithfield is the world’s largest pork producer. At the Perote, Mexico facility operated by Smithfield subsidary Granjas Carroll, 950,000 pigs were raised and sold for meat in 2008. According to the disease-tracking site Biosurveillance:Residents [of La Gloria, Perote Municipality, Veracruz State, Mexico] believed the outbreak had been caused by contamination from pig breeding farms located in the area. They believed that the farms, operated by Granjas Carroll, polluted the atmosphere and local water bodies, which in turn led to the disease outbreak. According to residents, the company denied responsibility for the outbreak and attributed the cases to ‘flu.’ However, a municipal health official stated that preliminary investigations indicated that the disease vector was a type of fly that reproduces in pig waste and that the outbreak was linked to the pig farms. It was unclear whether health officials had identified a suspected pathogen responsible for this outbreak.As of this moment, cases of the animal strain of the H1N1 virus have been reported in New York, California and Kansas. The virus has killed up to 68 people and there are currently 1,004 suspected cases in Mexico and 8 in the United States. However, there have been few mentions of the connection between swine flu and the Smithfield CAFO in the US news. There is an informative piece up on Huffington Post which gives a history by David Kirby. In it, the connection between industrial pork operations and potential disease is clear according to Ellen Silbergeld, professor of environmental health sciences at Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health, and a leading researcher of pathogen evolution in CAFOs. Here is a selection from Kirby’s piece:“CAFOs are not biosecure,” she told me. “They have high rates of ventilation and enormous number of animals that would die of heat stress unless the building was ventilated. We and others have measured bacteria and viruses in the environment around poultry and swine houses. They are carried by flies, too. These places are not bio-secure going in – or going out.”“These mixing bowls of intensive operations of chickens and pigs are contributing to speeding up viral evolution,” Dr. Silbergeld added. “I think CAFOs are contributing.”Huffington Post:http://www.huffingtonpost.com/david-kirby/swine-flu-outbreak—-nat_b_191408.html“The question, then, is could the Asian avian virus contain swine flu components from Eurasian pigs?”Absolutely,” said Ellen Silbergeld, professor of environmental health sciences at Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health, and a leading researcher of pathogen evolution in CAFOs. “A pig infected by avian virus can then come into contact with swine virus, which then combines and gets picked up by a bird again. It’s a viral patchwork. Wild birds can carry virus with swine components in it – a lot of avian viruses contain elements from pigs.”Silbergeld is by no means convinced that birds brought the Eurasian genetic material to Mexico.And of course, people fly, too. Dr. Silbergeld thinks that human travel is the most likely way that Eurasian swine viral components made their way to Mexico. “A tourist from China could have gone to Mexico City, and that Asian strain was picked up by somebody else, who then went to a swine barn,” she suggested. “It’s a likely explanation. Sometimes we overestimate what wild birds can do.”

PeterJBApril 25th, 2009 at 10:25 pm

A further thought:A year or so ago in the Courts of Ohio, the Magistrate, threw the claim to repossess property out due to unpaid mortgage payments, on the foundation that the German Plaintiff could not produce the original Deed and their presence at the time of the issuance of same as original Lender. Or, they couldn’t prove their rights as originating owner to the property – or, something like this.But above we have this organization called MERS built specifically for this purpose which begs the question, what happened in that Courtroom in Ohio, as referred to herein?Any ideas?

PeterJBApril 25th, 2009 at 11:23 pm

“In this light, anything that the government can try to do, absent continuing to print massive amounts of dollars, is irrelevant. The equity market can easily go up indefinitely, short squeezes can be generated at will, TALF can see 10 new, increasingly more meaningless permutations, the administration can prepare worthless stress tests that are neither stressing nor testing, and talk up a storm on cable TV to convince regular investors that all is well, yet none of these will do one thing to provide the banks and CMBS borrowers with the massive capital they will need to plug the value gap either during a CRE loan’s term or at maturity. The multi-trillion problem is simply too massive to be manipulated and is also too large to be simply swept under the carpet for the next administration and generation. It is inevitable that the monster hiding in the closet will have to be addressed head on, and the sooner it happens, the less the eventual destruction of individual and societal net worth (however, it still would be massive). Delaying the inevitable at this point is not a viable option: Zero Hedge hopes the administration realizes this, ironically, before it is too late.”http://zerohedge.blogspot.com/2009/04/one-trillion-commercial-real-estate.htmlHo hum

PeterJBApril 25th, 2009 at 11:39 pm

“The funny part, of course, is that Sumner is merely trying to show that his own theory–that the Fed caused the crisis by being far too restrictive up until last September–is actually very close to orthodox opinion. So Sumner is really saying, “You’re calling me nuts? Look, if I’m nuts, then everybody in the profession is nuts!”"That’s right, Dr. Sumner, welcome to the Austrian’s world.”http://consultingbyrpm.com/blog/2009/04/league-of-monetary-cranks.htmlThere are some really good articles (profound basic common sense and intelligence) appearing around the World now,; too late methinks but encouraging, nevertheless.Ho hum

AnonymousApril 26th, 2009 at 1:50 am

imagine the dilemma, the recent mexico and US flu is the same strain/type,so if WHO announced to quarantine mexico city shouldn’t America be treated the same…latest news:-PeterJB its down under nowhttp://english.cri.cn/6966/2009/04/26/2001s478863.htmA school group from New Zealand’s largest city of Auckland was being quarantined at home after returning from Mexico, New Zealand media reported on Sunday.An emergency decree has been declared in Mexico following the outbreak of a new flu virus suspected of killing 81 people there. The World Health Organization has declared the outbreaks of influenza-like illness in Mexico and four U.S. states as a “public health emergency of international concern”.Twenty-two students and three teachers from Auckland’s Rangitoto College were being quarantined at home in Auckland on Sunday after returning from Mexico, many with flu-like symptoms, Radio New Zealand reported.

MorbidApril 26th, 2009 at 5:10 am

Compare Philadelphia 1918, 1.75M population:1.Oct.1918: 117 died5.Oct: 254 died6.Oct:289 died9.Oct:428 diedCamp Devens, 45,000 soldiersSept.8 : 1st caseSep.23 : 63 deadSep.20: 1543 new casesSep.25:271 new casesSep.25: 83 deathsSep.19: sum=6,500 casesSep.26:sum=627 deaths6-8 weeks in a town , 3-4 weeks in a camphttp://www.flutrackers.com/forum/showthread.php?t=100545

MichelleApril 26th, 2009 at 7:45 am

How much of this insider selling can be attributed to the April 15th tax deadline? If selling continues past this deadline, then maybe an argument can be made about a deteriorating economic outlook. Right now it appears to be the former.

MichelleApril 26th, 2009 at 8:01 am

This flu outbreak is not reassuring to me, my family and my community after flying around the country this past week. I have flown on seven aircraft and been in five airports, twice at the DFW airport in Texas. Any flu symptoms and I’m headed straight to the doctor for a flu test and will quarantine my family until tests results confirm or deny my illness. So far so good, but I sure was lethargic yesterday, must be effects of traveling, I hope.

MM CAApril 26th, 2009 at 8:53 am

I got a few dumb questions regarding this article below…1. What f..king planet do these compamies and thier people work on?2. What is it they exactly do to earn this money, other than steal from people?3. What are thier skills other than a college degree?4. What amikes them think they should get so filthy rich managing other peoples money who actually Work?5. Who actually thinks we will recover form the mess and learn our lesson?6. If the avg is 500K what are the top dogs making? Must suck to be avg at one of these banks…After an Off Year, Wall Street Pay Is Bouncing BackOf the large banks receiving federal help, Goldman Sachs stands out for setting aside the most per person for compensation. The bank, which nearly halved its compensation last year, set aside $4.7 billion for worker pay in the quarter. If that level continues all year, it would add up to average pay of $569,220 per worker — almost as much as the pay in 2007, a record year.At other banks, pay scales tilt in favor of particular units. JPMorgan Chase, for example, is setting aside what would total $138,234 on average for workers. But in the bank’s trading and investment banking unit, if revenue stays at first-quarter levels, workers are on track to earn an average of $509,524 over the year. That figure was $345,147 in 2006.http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/26/business/26pay.html?_r=2&hp

MM CAApril 26th, 2009 at 8:56 am

Only a matter of time for the below to play out… Calif is turning into a total disaster these daysWhen California Defaults http://www.businessinsider.com/when-california-defaults-2009-4Felix Salmon has a great series of posts, all worth reading, on a subject of emergin importance: state and muni defaults. It’s not a very well known subject just due to the fact that there haven’t been many state and muni defaults over the years.There just isn’t much to go on. Here’s a speech he gave to a local bond dealers association, and here’s one on the possibility of a muni default “wave”.And this one look looks specifically at the State of California, a state which we used to look at pridefully as one of the most beautiful, biggest economies in the world, but which is now for all intents and purposes broke. Worse than the UK probably. Of course if the UK defaulted, it’d send shockwaves throughout the global economy.What then can we expect if California — famous for its political gridlock, particularly around issues of taxing and spending — decides to default.Felix offers up some thoughts:The more powerful argument why California won’t default is that a payment default is illegal under state law: California’s simply not allowed to default on its bonds. But what are the monolines going to do, sue? If California defaults on say a $1 billion payment which the monolines have to pay, then California owes the monolines $1 billion. If the monolines sue the state and win, then California owes the monolines $1 billion. It’s not clear that they’ve advanced very far. Could they start attaching state assets? I doubt it, somehow.My hope is that the monolines would get their money back reasonably quickly — the unintended consequences of a default would force California’s dysfunctional legislature to wake up to the pettiness of its actions, and serious fiscal policies might finally be able to be passed. But I can’t say that outcome is particularly probable: the California legislature has shown no signs of being grown-up in the past, or even of moving in that direction.And indeed the really nasty unintended consequences of a Californian default might well be felt outside the state, with the closing down of the municipal bond market nationally. Once California defaults, it’s hard to see any other state raising private general-obligation funds at any kind of interest rate it would consider acceptable.Which brings us back to the moral-hazard play: maybe the Feds would bail out California, not for California’s sake, but rather for the sake of the municipal bond markets as a whole. But it’s hard to see where they would get the money, or how Congress would ever approve such an appropriation.We are all California, hail the Governator!

GuestApril 26th, 2009 at 9:05 am

Gold is a risk! First off it is no more a store of value as fiat currency in fact less. Governments of the world sanction and control what is to be allowed as a medium of exchange for value and the governments dictate fiat currency to be the trade-able exchange medium, not gold. For gold to really take off people around the world would have to bypass their governments authority and start using it as a medium of exchange and if or when people try doing that watch the governments around the world out law it in a hurry. By buying gold, short of some speculative bubble that may happen what you are really doing is trying to undermine the government authority and military you ever heard the song “I fought the law and the law won”.2ndly everyone I know these days has way less money to spend massive amounts of money have been pulled from the system and that’s hardly inflationary when people need to eat they sell everything including their gold. Yes the government is borrowing too much money and that can and will cause inflation but will it be enough to completely undermine the governments authority and their currency by allowing gold to be the new currency? Pretty big gamble by a lot of you guys if you ask me.

kilgoresApril 26th, 2009 at 10:18 am

True, subgenius. Good luck trying to convince members of the Inhoff crowd who post here, though.SWK

kilgoresApril 26th, 2009 at 10:30 am

I agree. Efforts to adhere to the Gold Standard in the 1930s only exacerbated the depth and length of the economic downturn.The Chinese have proposed tying the value of currency to a basket of 30 or so industrial raw goods, such as copper (which they seem to be buying up in u usually large quantities these days).Don’t know if this would overcome problems of a single commodity-based currency standard, such as gold. I imagine it could make the adverse effects even worseSWK

GuestApril 26th, 2009 at 10:34 am

It’s hard to see where the Fed would get the cash or how Congress would ever approve such an appropriation? Well, in thatbonds = expansion of credit via a money substitute and in that credit = banker language for “excess reserves” and in thatexcess reserves = money waiting to be created, and in that the Fed creates money at will with no oversight from Congressad infinitum until collapse, you have your answer — inflation. Fiat money is government and banker purchasing powerwithout taxes.The boom-bust effect of inflation is the gradual evaporation of the people’s purchasing power and the continuous transferof property to those who control government and run banks.The public has the last say so, however. If no one wants to borrow their money, the game is over.

AnonymousApril 26th, 2009 at 10:41 am

just swell aint ithttp://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/N25473389.htmNew flu has spread widely, cannot be contained-CDCSource: ReutersWASHINGTON, April 25 (Reuters) – An unusual new flu virus has spread widely and cannot be contained, the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention confirmed on Saturday.”It is clear that this is widespread. And that is why we have let you know that we cannot contain the spread of this virus,” the CDC’s Dr. Anne Schuchat told reporters on a conference call.

HubbsApril 26th, 2009 at 10:50 am

Yep MM CA, the best and the brightest need to be well compensated.The reality is that when you have nothing substantial to offer society, and you therefore have nothing to lose from your own efforts, you have a pretty powerful incentive to specialize in the fine art of the fleece.

FEDupApril 26th, 2009 at 11:06 am

agree! The stock market can be manipulated to keep rising as the primary players (US govt and Goldman Sachs) wield plenty of influence; however, every small business owner I have spoken to has said the same thing: between a significant drop off of sales/services and huge reduction in credit line, many are surviving on a week to week basis. This means those businesses who lease retail/commercial space are quickly approaching the day of reckoning. Their failure along with resetting of CRE loans will likely hammer the final nails into the economic coffin of the U.S. economy resulting in a rapid market fall that will be TBTS (Too Big To Stop)!

PeteCAApril 26th, 2009 at 11:09 am

My earlier comments were not intended to promote fear. And I agree that the speculation that the virus is engineered probably belongs more in the pages of a thriller in the New York Times list. But if someone wanted to create a virus that was effective as a weapon of fear against a human population, what you are looking at in Mexico City is certainly a plausible possibility. Influenze viruses can spread very quickly through the human population, and they are very contagious in airborn form. A new ‘flu viru also tends to raise less suspicion when it first occurs, because doctors tend to suspect it’s probably just another case of the same old suff that’s going around.Fortunately, we’ve some very good things working for us. The SARS out break in Asia helped the international community to come together and work much faster against these kinds of threats. That seems to be really paying off now – with the Mexico incident. I am cautiously optimistic that the authorities will get on top of this. So I’m not really worrying that much myself (although this is bound to wind up on the cover of Time magazine!). But I wouldn’t be surprised at all to learn that the situtation in some parts of Mexico is worse than the media are reporting. Exactly the same thing happened in China during the early stages of SARS.PeteCA

GuestApril 26th, 2009 at 11:39 am

Apocalypse will commethhttp://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/comment/ambroseevans_pritchard/5220118/The-capital-well-is-running-dry-and-some-economies-will-wither.html

GuestApril 26th, 2009 at 11:41 am

But why is this April 15 different from past April 15s for these people, particularly in that 2008 was not a big year for profits, andtherefore taxes? Just a thought.Speaking of profits, yesterday I talked with a proprietor in a tourist town gift shop in California. She said this weekend will determine,for her at least, if customers are returning to their former buying levels.At the same time, she told me that her health insurance just inceased to $900.00 a month. Well, I said, at least you can take aportion of it off your taxes.She replied, “Only if I’m making a profit, and I’m not making a profit.”I love the logic of government!

kilgoresApril 26th, 2009 at 12:05 pm

That’s just another hedge, I assume. With reference to the last five years, you could say the same thing about their acquisition of U.S. Treasuries, couldn’t you?SWK

kilgoresApril 26th, 2009 at 1:39 pm

From the New York Times:http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/27/world/27flu.html?hpU.S. Declares Public Health Emergency Over Swine FluBy KEITH BRADSHER and JACK HEALYPublished: April 26, 2009American health officials on Sunday declared a publichealth emergency over increasing cases of swine flu, saying that they had confirmed 20 cases of the disease in the United States and expected to see more as investigators fan out to track down the path of the outbreak….SWK

MichelleApril 26th, 2009 at 2:15 pm

PeteCAYour comments aren’t alarming, at least to me, and I hope most people on this blog understand the difference between nature and bio-terrorism, both can have devastating effects, or maybe not. Precautions should be taken and panic will only make things worse.I personally have a stockpile of supplies as part of any disaster plan and recommend others do the same. This too shall pass.

idunnoApril 26th, 2009 at 3:47 pm

Thank you for your opinion. imho, we are looking at yet another variant of the WMD tactic.In case you were sleeping, the most outlandish fear injection variant used recently was in the autumn of 2008, when the govt,fin.industry, & congress put a gun to the head of the populous concerning economic collapse.The scale of the abuse is so extreme nowadays, that even a bright blogger like you is becoming numb to the tactics, and that is very sad.

PeteCAApril 26th, 2009 at 4:09 pm

Probablt just covering their bases. It gives the President greater authorization to take emergency measures if they are needed. There’s a potential issue about controlling travel across the border to Mexico, and they probably want the issue to shut it down (both ways) if necessary.PeteCA

subgeniusApril 26th, 2009 at 4:16 pm

re-arrange into a well known phrase:door the horse shutting bolted the has stable afterIt is already too late to prevent the spread. Incubation is in the 1-7 day range, human-to-human transmission is apparently easy, and the outbreak in Mexico is 3+ weeks old. There are known occurrences in multiple countries throuhout both hemispheres. The best outcome is that this strain isn’t too deadly. So far only the Mexican victims appear to be having problems, though nobody seems to understand why…

subgeniusApril 26th, 2009 at 4:29 pm

BTW: Tamiflu does not “treat” flu, it acts as an inhibitor to the spread of the disease from infected host cells. It also has serious enough side-effects that the Japanese have banned it’s use in individuals under the age of 20 since the SARS episode.

kilgoresApril 26th, 2009 at 6:18 pm

Funny you say that, subgenius. I recall the swine flu pandemic scare under the Ford administration. My entire family went in for the swine flu vaccine — all but me — and they all fell ill from the vaccine.SWK

GuestApril 26th, 2009 at 6:25 pm

i read that younger have more of an immunity and that most deaths were 20 to 40 yrs olds. and here most cases were of young so far. but since it is so early even in mexico maybe not many old have been exposed so far with then maybe death rates will be higher when the old do get exposed.

subgeniusApril 26th, 2009 at 6:30 pm

This is incorrect.Generally, the reason for deaths from pandemics falling in the 20ish-40ish age range are because individuals in this range have a strong immune system that is prepared to fight all-out for survival. The immune response is what kills, NOT the flu itself. Think of it as drowning in your own phlegm…

GuestApril 26th, 2009 at 7:13 pm

Taking Liberties with Price Stability by The Mogambo GuruPaul Volcker, the legendary former chairman of the Federal Reserve who heroically defeated a raging inflation, against powerful politicalopposition, which was the result of massive government spending in the ’60s and ’70s on wars and increased entitlement spending, and who is nowmysteriously part of the ridiculous Obama team of economic nitwits occupying in the White House, has finally said something!After all these months of sheer economic idiocy flooding from the White House, Congress, the Federal Reserve and everywhere you turn, Paul Volcker hasfinally said something!And, even more deliciously, he said it to Fed Vice-chairman Donald Kohn, one of the arrogant, lowlife mental defectives whoseegregious monetary actions got us into the mess we are in, at some dorky “question-and-answer session at a conference” in Nashville, Tennessee.As the Wall Street Journal reports, “the former Fed chairman grilled Mr. Kohn over the Fed’s effort to convey that it considers a 2% inflation rateto be appropriate for the U.S. economy in the long term” and he, “questions how the Fed can talk about both 2% inflation and price stability.”Mr. Volcker actually said, “I don’t get it,” which is a Big Fat Lie (BFL), because he understands it perfectly, but he is just so polite and sopolitic that he finds it hard to say, as I would have so succinctly put it, “How…can you talk about purposely creating at least 2% inflation in pricesand then talk about the Fed’s duty to pursue price stability at the same…time, which gives rise to the expression ‘talking out of both sides of yourmouth at the same time’, and also gives rise to an occasion for me to call you a lying halfwit economic ignoramus who thinks that everybody else is sostupid that you can say such utter preposterous #@%8# like this to me and think I am going to swallow it!”I mean, the idea for the…Federal Reserve in the First…Place (FFP) was to make sure that inflation did NOT get above zero! The Federal Reserve was givenextraordinary, probably un-Constitutional powers over all the money and banks of the United States, to provide them with a “flexible” money supply andwith the awesome power of a fiat currency to do it with, on the condition that they “promote price stability,” which means zero inflation in prices!Zero!I mean, how…simple can it…be?And not only does “price stability” mean Zero… Inflation (ZFI) in prices, it has ALWAYS meant zero inflation in prices,and yet, now, astonishingly, here is an obviously complete failure, the Federal Reserve Vice-chairman, presiding as he does over a busted economy ofhis own making, telling us that, as Mr. Volcker explains, “people in a generation are going to be losing half their purchasing power” thanks to2% inflation! Gaaahhh!Now, having a currency that is losing half its purchasing power may not mean anything – absolutely nothing! – to an incompetentgovernment and autonomous agencies staffed with obviously incompetent people who all can, and will, double their own salaries at their whim.“Prices rise? Give yourself more money!”It means a bit more, however, to people who have private-sector jobs, as wages will only slowly increase to match the gradual doubling in prices aswage increases trail inflation with a lag, which means that workers will suffer financially the entire time.And even after wage and benefit adjustments,and even after some theoretical cessation of inflation in prices, private-sector workers will never really catch up, and will therefore almostcertainly suffer permanent net-wealth impairment.And a currency that loses half its purchasing power means a lot to those on fixed incomes, likeretirees living on annuities or fixed retirement benefits, and who will never, ever see an increase in their incomes from those sources, but who muststill pay the doubled prices, and then higher and higher prices from there, if they live that long.But a currency “losing half its purchasing power in a generation” means the most to those people who do not have jobs at all, and those who cannothave jobs, and therefore they have no income at all, but who still must pay all the doubled prices!And although Mr. Kohn does not use the word “sacrifice,” or the phrase “The Federal Reserve is going to make it possible for the government to steal youblind,” or admit that “The people of the United States and the world are going to be consumed in the fires of inflationary hell so that the FederalReserve can continue to create misery and failure, while having fun playing around with their completely idiotic neo-Keynesian econometric stupidities,an absurdity that has completely captivated the dunderheads in the major universities of the dumbed-down USA, like Princeton, which has such lowacademic standards that Ben Bernanke, the bozo that is now the chairman of the Federal Reserve, was the head of their economics department! Hahaha!”So while Mr. Kohn is careful not to say any of these things, he does say that acting so insanely as to deliberately try and cause the horror of (at least)continual 2% inflation in prices gives the Federal Reserve “a little more room…to react to an adverse shock to the economy.” Hahahaha!Excuse my laughter, but this laughable pipsqueak says that everyone must suffer a falling standard of living over, at least, the next generation, so thatthe Fed can create so much money, flooding the world with money to loan and literally buying up old loans, that they can pound interest ratesdown, down, down lower than the rate of inflation, which the WSJ notes, is “the usual remedy for recession”! Hahahaha!And ifinflation in prices is “the usual remedy for recession,” then it certainly is!And while the inflation in consumer prices is not (yet) raging out of control and there are not yet food riots in the streets, theJOC-ECRI Industrial Price Index just shot up to 72.63 from 69.75.And as for what to do about it, I can only tell you that there has never been anything better than gold, which, now that I think about it,says it all!Whee! This investing stuff is easy!http://www.lewrockwell.com/orig10/mogambo8.html

kilgoresApril 26th, 2009 at 7:51 pm

Thank you, I think. We fell for the Gulf of Tonkin incident, we fell for the WMD nonsense in Iraq, and we’ll undoubtedly fall for another such bogus manipulation of public opinion in the future. I appreciate fully your concerns.I don’t think I’ve become numb to the fear-mongering tactics you describe; rather, I find that it remains impossible to discern readily whether one is facing a “Wag the Dog” fabrication or a genuine emergency. Prudence, in my view, dictates erring generally on the side of presuming the possible validity of the asserted crisis and doing one’s best to continually ascertain the true facts bearing on the same. Otherwise, one may wind up like the villagers who, having come to the aid of the boy shepherd who cried “Wolf!” more than once before, eventually ignore his genuine pleas and wind up losing their flock. I’d rather waste time being called to a false alarm and punish the fellows who set it off than to find the next morning that the house I could have saved has burned down.As I’ve heard an old Middle East saying goes, trust in Allah, but tie up your camel.SWK

kilgoresApril 26th, 2009 at 8:00 pm

Yep. That’s why many, if not most, of the Spanish Flu victims turned blue in the face: death was usually from pneumonia often caused by hemorrhaging that filled their lungs with fluid — precipitated by an auto-immune response — so they wound up drowning in their own bodily fluids. Blech!SWK

blind economic unitApril 26th, 2009 at 8:09 pm

j,as it is today..maybe one is the product and the other isthe packaging and selling of the product?

AnonymousApril 26th, 2009 at 8:13 pm

CDC announced something about a mutation in Denmark..i think this “film” will be rated PG soon

HayesApril 26th, 2009 at 8:36 pm

via ZHThe world economyA glimmer of hope?Apr 23rd 2009From The Economist print editionThe worst thing for the world economy would be to assume the worst is overhttp://www.economist.com/printedition/displayStory.cfm?Story_ID=13527685

HayesApril 26th, 2009 at 9:06 pm

From Barron’sSATURDAY, APRIL 25, 2009This Rally Has an Uneasy FeelBy MICHAEL SANTOLIhttp://online.barrons.com/article_email/SB124061358501154645-lMyQjAxMDI5NDIwNjYyMTYzWj.html

GuestApril 26th, 2009 at 9:12 pm

RGE thinks the link is too long. Copy and paste in another window to see. Zoom out too see world.

FFApril 26th, 2009 at 9:55 pm

The Chinese buying of Treasuries allowed them to game the system. China would not be the economic powerthey are today without the American consumer buying their goods and financing their manufacturing growth.True, their increase in Gold reserves is a calculated hedge against the devaluation of the dollar. Gold doeshold its value over the long run whereas every fiat currencies goes eventually to its intrinsic value.Everyone knows the US can never pay off its debt without defaulting or, most likely, serious inflation. I, therefore,would follow the path of the Chinese and buy Gold

Brett in ManhattanApril 26th, 2009 at 10:40 pm

From the paper that brought you, “Buy GM” at 18, and “Dow 15K” in August 2007.

g AntonApril 26th, 2009 at 11:12 pm

An Explanatory Short StoryThere’s quite a bit of discussion and controversy about who is at fault for the present economic mess (and there’s plenty of fault to go around), but there is little discussion or controversy about who is responsible for creating the environment and situations that made this grotesque reality possible. Of course, I’m talking about the bubble-master twins (namely Milton Friedman and Ben Bernanke). Milt had a John-The-Baptist like relation to Ben–he came to prepare the way for him. But you have to give Ben credit. Ben is the biggest spender in history by a factor of ten or so, and he’s not done yet. He makes FDR look like a piker, and Ben’s spending record may well endure forever. He reminds me of a doctor that gives you medicine that makes you sick, and then charges you a fortune for trying to cure the illness for which he himself was largely responsible.Anyway, while my short story is semi-fictional, it does supply an Occam’s razor type explanation of what happened:—–Once upon a time, not too long ago, on one of those rare occasions when Ben wasn’t talking, hefell into a meditative mode. His thinking went something like this:”This great country hungers for great wealth! I could design and implement a virtual factory that Americans and selected foreigners could use to create wealth like the world has never seen. An unlimited supply of seed money would be available for investment purposes, and I’d actually pay people to borrow it. And there would be little regulation or monitoring of activities so as not to stifle creativity or risk-taking. I am a great fabricator! I will fabricate such a virtual wealth creation factory! I will build it, and they will come!”He was certainly right about that–they did come:They came by twos, they came by foursThey came by eights, they came by scoresCame the old and the young ones tooTo try their hand at Bernanke voodoo.They came singing. “Hi Ho, Hi Ho, it’s off to work we go!” And the fruits of their labor were fabulous. Firstly, new forms of bond-like investment certificates were invented which facilitated a leveraging of invested seed money by a factor of thirty or forty. This in turn had other spectacular results: To mention just a fewThe Dow and the GDP soared off into the stratosphere. Of course, some skeptics were quick to point out that the soaring DOW was based on a soaring GDP, which was in turn based on the American consumer “buying things he doesn’t need with money that he doesn’t have”. But of course, there are a few nay sayers in every crowd.There is another spectacular result that I like in particular because it has a democratic savor to it. Many paupers were (and some still are) living in million dollar houses! (Some paupers actually had two million dollar houses–one for summer use and the other for the winter.) And that’s not the best part of it–every year the value of these houses increased 10%, and the pauper only had to go to the bank and sign his name, and the bank would give him the 10% in cash. Some members of congress were concerned that these practices might lead to problems, but Ben assured them that this was not the case. For example, in October of 2005, Ben Bernanke that told the congress that they didn’t have to worry about the housing bubble busting because the increases in housing prices was based on “very strong economic fundamentals”?There are other examples (such as commercial real estate, bank credit card, etc.), but this gets tedious very fast. But needless to say, there was widespread euphoria about economy, and this euphoria included the President of the United States George Bush, who often referred to the “good economy” and its “solid foundations”.Anyway, there was a late comer to Ben’s factory–the GGE (the Greater Global Economy), who arrived singing a different song from that of the early comers:”Down, Down, Down I comeLike glistening Phaeton losing the manage of unruly jades”—Dear reader, please do not complain that this short story is too short–it is not over yet.For example, Ben insists that the economy will return to the etheral state it was in when his wealth factory was at at maximum production, Tim Geithner swears by this, and Obama believes in what they say. For this to happen, it seems to me that Ben’s wealth factory will, like the phoenix bird, have to rise again from its ashes, and hopefully like the phoenix, will last 500 years. (In other words, how can an economy not on steroids and in decline return to the level of an economy on steroids?) But Ben and Tim, both honorable men, say that this is so, and Obama believes them, so I guess that’s the way it is.

GuestApril 27th, 2009 at 12:05 am

Poor Obama. These fools at Fed & Treasury will be the undoing of an otherwise promising Presidency.

PeterJBApril 27th, 2009 at 5:23 am

Just a Hunch – that it – I have no supportive evidence, but,my “gut” tells me that Goldman Sachs will soon bite the dust – Really Big Time! There is something that smell rotten here…and, I think that this is “the” subtle event that will mark the end of the Old and the beginning of the New.Disclaimer: I repeat: Intuition Only – gut feeling and Absolutely No specific data to support this statement.Your mileage will vary. Have a nice day!Ho hum

PeterJBApril 27th, 2009 at 5:33 am

Correction Alert:Just a Hunch – that is* – I have no supportive evidence, but,my “gut” tells me that Goldman Sachs will soon bite the dust – Really Big Time! There is something that smells* rotten here…and, I think that this is “the” subtle event (winds from butterfly wings) that will mark the end of the Old and the beginning of the New.Disclaimer: I repeat: Intuition Only – gut feeling and Absolutely No specific data to support this statement.Your mileage will vary. Have a nice day!Ho humReply to this comment By PeterJB on 2009-04-27 05:23:25

The AlarmistApril 27th, 2009 at 7:10 am

I was just visiting the US for the first time in six months, and the only thing that was noticeably cheaper was petrol. Everything else has been ratcheted up to some degree in the past few years, which reflects the significant decline in the PPP of the USD … one could make the argument that a good part of the RE bubble in the last few years was an adjustment of RE prices to reflect the fall in the value of the USD due to inflation. So I wouldn’t expect RE to fall back to its “pre-bubble” levels.

GuestApril 27th, 2009 at 7:42 am

Network News has shifted gear the past few days. No longer should we worry about Bernanke/Geithner/Obama destroyingthe last vestiges of capitalism, we should worry about contacting the Mexican Swine Flu.I don’t want to diminish the possibility of it turning pandemic (my grandmother diedfrom the 1918 influenza epidemic), but I do have a great deal of difficulty with boththe timing of the news, and the voracity of the news networks in disseminating the news.Also problematic is every “talking head” bureaucrat from here to kingdom come telling usthey have everything under control. It’s very reminiscent of Bernanke telling us in theearly stages of the credit crisis that “everything was under control” and the cost wouldbe $50 million, oops $50 billion, oops …http://safehaven.com/article-13203.htm

The AlarmistApril 27th, 2009 at 8:02 am

“Wise men attempted to give us a power-balanced republic.”Yes, indeed, and so-called reformers proceeded over the years to ensure that that system was corrupted into a pseudo democracy that allowed a permanent power-elite to take hold as they had in every other political system up to that point. Of course more than a few people will tell you that those “wise men” were a corrupt lot of slave-holding elites, but hey, at least they tried.I’m looking forward to the coming de-evolution …. Well, gotta go now … have ammo to fill and arms to clean.

GuestApril 27th, 2009 at 8:21 am

So I should address my resume to the attention of Mr. Fink?Why resist the party and die in the gulag when one can join the party and have a nice little dacha by the sea?

The AlarmistApril 27th, 2009 at 8:24 am

Wrong question … did someone in the Obi entourage loose this pest on Mexico as part of a secret plot to counter the growing Mexican threat to the US?

The AlarmistApril 27th, 2009 at 8:29 am

What, you still open your mail? Thought you would have stopped doing that during the Anthrax scare.

The AlarmistApril 27th, 2009 at 8:44 am

Yes, it’s all a giant plot of the Obamaniacs, who, sensing certain failure of their beloved administration, are now playing up a new ‘crisis’ that is bringing a new round of chaos just as salvation was within our reach.As someone else here said, “Ho Hum.”

GuestApril 27th, 2009 at 8:59 am

g, consider fatigue from running by the side of the bus.negotiating time warp. internal and externalrhythm, clashing. central nervous systemirritation due to digital madness. overload.retreat to paper pages and cloud sighting.still hanging on words,

JasonApril 27th, 2009 at 3:20 pm

Yes, yes… you are the FEIRST … as you like!I approve it, but with some restrictions that I’d like to not sey this time!Congratulations and “Thanks for your cooperation” (vide very hard-dramatic scene of “The 5th Element”).In time: Dollar no longer will sustain its liberatory power!Some guys talk about Hiperinflation, global hiperinflation!This is a serious risk in my view.China is leaving the Dollar peg but slowly, aiming no panic all the market!Brazil also.All we know what this means!Mis besosyour Jason

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